Salaam Alaikum.

[Socrates]

Just kidding, I'm not a Muslim. I'm an atheist.

I was raised in Protestant Christianity and honestly believed the whole deal for most of my life. I attended Baptist churches, Churches of Christ, Methodist, Free Methodist, Four Square, Lutheran, Wesleyan, Catholic, Orthodox, and other denominations that I can't immediately remember.

Over the years, my doubts accumulated until one day I had to be honest with myself and admit that I just didn't believe in God any more. That was a good day for me.

Anyway, I'm not here to troll or harass anybody. I just like to debate, as the name Socrates should imply.

Also, your smilies sold me on registering. Look at this: This is great! I love these smilies!


edit: Perhaps I should say my top 5 is...

1. BIG
2. KRS-ONE
3. Nas
4. Scarface
5. Ghostface

[Cowboy]

Well, welcome to the board. Maybe you can make a thread about the "doubts" that accumulated, just so we can see where you're coming from. Either way, you're right, this board does have good smilies.


Just don't abuse them.

[JARZJR]

Just kidding, I'm not a Muslim. I'm an atheist.

I was raised in Protestant Christianity and honestly believed the whole deal for most of my life. I attended Baptist churches, Churches of Christ, Methodist, Free Methodist, Four Square, Lutheran, Wesleyan, Catholic, Orthodox, and other denominations that I can't immediately remember.

Over the years, my doubts accumulated until one day I had to be honest with myself and admit that I just didn't believe in God any more. That was a good day for me.

Anyway, I'm not here to troll or harass anybody. I just like to debate, as the name Socrates should imply.

Also, your smilies sold me on registering. Look at this: This is great! I love these smilies!


edit: Perhaps I should say my top 5 is...

1. BIG
2. KRS-ONE
3. Nas
4. Scarface
5. Ghostface

Whats good, Socrates?

Welcome to HCR... Round these parts we worship the true and living God, but i'm sure you gathered that by now ...

I'm sure folks will be willing to discuss your atheism with you. And by the Spirit, attempt to reason with you concerning sin, righteousness, and judgement. But its real late right now... You should come back during the day time... People will probably discuss with you, but if it turns into a endless circle it might get shut down...

Have a good night, sir....

[djHeir]

Welcome!

[shekinahsmoke]

Just kidding, I'm not a Muslim. I'm an atheist.

I was raised in Protestant Christianity and honestly believed the whole deal for most of my life. I attended Baptist churches, Churches of Christ, Methodist, Free Methodist, Four Square, Lutheran, Wesleyan, Catholic, Orthodox, and other denominations that I can't immediately remember.

Over the years, my doubts accumulated until one day I had to be honest with myself and admit that I just didn't believe in God any more. That was a good day for me.

Anyway, I'm not here to troll or harass anybody. I just like to debate, as the name Socrates should imply.

Also, your smilies sold me on registering. Look at this: This is great! I love these smilies!


edit: Perhaps I should say my top 5 is...

1. BIG
2. KRS-ONE
3. Nas
4. Scarface
5. Ghostface

no sign of reformed or sovereign grace on that list so ok you're in.










im just joking with ya....

I just like to debate

why doth there exist people who like to debate... ITS NOT HEALTHY and its trifling.

[eve]

Welcome, Socrates!

Over the years, my doubts accumulated until one day I had to be honest with myself and admit that I just didn't believe in God any more.

Some people say that what convinces them that there is a god is that when they see a building or a painting or a handbag, they instinctively know that someone made those things. They know those things didn't just pop out of the blue. So my question is ... if you, too, see buildings and paintings and handbags and know instinctively that someone had to have made those things, why do you not apply the same logic to bigger "things" like the Earth or the Solar System?

Thanks!

Eve

[Socrates]

why doth there exist people who like to debate... ITS NOT HEALTHY and its trifling.

First of all, please don't abuse Shakespearian English. I'm not a Christian, but I love the King James Bible for its beautiful language.

Second, debate is great. What are you talking about? Debate is how pretty much any disagreement is settled. The early church had plenty to debate about.

Some people say that what convinces them that there is a god is that when they see a building or a painting or a handbag, they instinctively know that someone made those things. They know those things didn't just pop out of the blue. So my question is ... if you, too, see buildings and paintings and handbags and know instinctively that someone had to have made those things, why do you not apply the same logic to bigger "things" like the Earth or the Solar System?

I'm familiar with what you're saying here. You're talking about certain responses to William Paley's watchmaker analogy.

Thing is, I don't instinctively know that buildings and paintings are the work of men. I know those things are made by men because I have first hand knowledge of the fact that men make those things. It's impossible for us to have firsthand knowledge of how the universe (I'll skip the Earth and the solar system and go straight to the entire universe) came to be.

However, just because we couldn't be around to see it happen doesn't mean we can't figure it out. Thousands of years ago, people proposed various ideas about gods creating the world. The idea that only one god was involved became the most popular, which I think is natural. Why have ten chiefs when you only need one? And you don't really want more bosses than you need, anyway.

Now, if I had lived all those thousands of years ago, I might just go along with that proposal. Men make huts and loincloths, so sure, maybe a really big powerful man made the rivers and the forests. I could have gone with that, back in the day.

But today, we have really good explanations for the origin of the universe and they don't require a god to work. There is no gap anymore. I certainly wouldn't say we know exactly how the whole thing started, but we have great explanations that are plausible and logical. There is simply no need for God any more. That theory has been replaced.

I'm no expert on physics, but even I can tell you that if the planet was designed, it wasn't designed as well as many people like to think. Most of it is utterly uninhabitable. Less than 1% of the water is good enough for us to drink. Hurricanes routinely wipe out thousands of people. Asteroids hit us once in a while and wipe out species. And species... if they're designed, their designer was a malicious character. Most creatures survive by mutilating and eating other animals.

Now if you believe all of that is the fault of two people (who don't know the difference between good and evil yet) eating some fruit, you already know that we disagree. But that's my view.

[shekinahsmoke]

First of all, please don't abuse Shakespearian English. I'm not a Christian, but I love the King James Bible for its beautiful language.

why not abuse it? Im ghetto. lol. i use the esv btw.

Second, debate is great. What are you talking about? Debate is how pretty much any disagreement is settled. The early church had plenty to debate about.

one, a council is not a debate.
two, all debates mostly were with those who brought false doctrine.
rock.

[Socrates]

one, a council is not a debate.

That's debateable.

two, all debates mostly were with those who brought false doctrine.
rock.

How are you certain of what is true and what is false doctrine? That's still being debated in the church today, quite heavily. That's why denominations exist. Are you so arrogant (no diss) as to say that you have the absolute truth, from God's own hand?

[d.hyde]

Socrates, why don't you just call the number on this page, and ask him any questions or debate with him. I'm pretty sure he would give you the answers you seek and he is on today in a couple of hours, and also again on Tuesday. Thanxx.
http://www.aomin.org/articles/webcast.html

[shekinahsmoke]

Are you so arrogant (no diss) as to say that you have the absolute truth, from God's own hand?

well well. there's the issue isnt it now. why didnt you just say that before? take d.hydes advice. I dont like this stuff man. you could pm me though and I'll give you my phone number. we can talk this out like gentlemen.

[d.hyde]

I didn't hear you on there today
However I'm sure the brother will be able to answer any questions you have to ask on Tuesday. Please call. That way your voice, and ideologies can be heard across the nation, not just some forum. I don't know what exactly it is you are seeking for here, you don't appear to be content with the responses you have here with your rebuttals, but I am certain he can help you on Tuesday http://www.aomin.org/articles/webcast.html. Hit him up!! He answers questions from non Christians frequently

[Socrates]

Sorry, but I'm not going to provide free content for some guy's radio show. Radio shows are really the most dishonest form of propaganda. If you've ever listened to Limbaugh or Hannity, you know exactly what I'm talking about. The host has the callers on an 8 second delay so if you say anything that would really upset them, they can cut you off before the audience even hears you. If you get past that, they can still mute you at any time, hang up on you, or just ramble right over you and declare victory. It's ridiculous.

Now you guys know that I'm an atheist. I'm not hiding anything and I have extremely thick skin, so if you got any criticism, I can handle it. I came here to talk to y'all and if y'all don't want that, that's okay. But don't try to pawn me off on some dude with a webcast. I'm not interested in supporting his mini$try, if you know what I mean.

[JARZJR]

Sorry, but I'm not going to provide free content for some guy's radio show. Radio shows are really the most dishonest form of propaganda. If you've ever listened to Limbaugh or Hannity, you know exactly what I'm talking about. The host has the callers on an 8 second delay so if you say anything that would really upset them, they can cut you off before the audience even hears you. If you get past that, they can still mute you at any time, hang up on you, or just ramble right over you and declare victory. It's ridiculous.

Now you guys know that I'm an atheist. I'm not hiding anything and I have extremely thick skin, so if you got any criticism, I can handle it. I came here to talk to y'all and if y'all don't want that, that's okay. But don't try to pawn me off on some dude with a webcast. I'm not interested in supporting his mini$try, if you know what I mean.

I'm not laughin at you.
Well... I am laughing at you, but it's not in a bad way

Alpha and Omega Ministries is SUPER low budget, lol...

Honestly, a lot of confusion about christian ministries having mad $$$ comes from the exposure of the most famous TV and Radio preachers, aka pulpit pimps. And worst of all, their theology is mostly sub-biblical. (Most, not all). Most of us around here don't like the way they get rich anymore than you do


The Dividing Line program is just a webcast that has several thousand weekly listeners and podcasters worldwide.
The thing is that it's run by Dr. James White, who also happens to be arguably, one of the finest Christian apologists/debaters in the western Hemisphere.

He debates a broad range of topics with the top people in their respective religions/fields all over the world. He has formally debated a lot of famous atheists like Dan Barker, Bart Ehrman, and Bryan Lynch, and he has phone debated Christopher Hitchens. You'll be up there with the big boys, lol...

Check his credentials here...
http://www.aomin.org/articles/bio.html

Look him up on Youtube.


So, if you really think you got some compelling arguements you should try them on him.

Censorship? If you get too out of hand and won't let him speak, he'll tell you he's lowering your volume until you chill out, but thats about it. He's a reasonable guy.

Oh... Don't worry about supporting him financially. The call is toll free, and he makes his money off of selling his books, his debates, and donations...


Call in...

[KPfaREAL]

He's not going to call in, he knows better. He'd rather spread his message to some who are still drinking milk and don't know any better.

[eve]

Thank you for your reply!

But today, we have really good explanations for the origin of the universe and they don't require a god to work. There is no gap anymore. I certainly wouldn't say we know exactly how the whole thing started, but we have great explanations that are plausible and logical. There is simply no need for God any more. That theory has been replaced.

Every time I discuss this with my brother, and he says the Universe originated with the Big Bang (and not God), so I ask him the following question: Where did the Big Bang come from?

He tells me it came from particles that, over a long time, came together and collided.

I ask him where those particles came from.

He tells me other particles.

I ask him where those came from.

He says other particles.

And you see that there's no end to that convo.

So what do you say? I think you realize that everything needed to have come from somewhere, correct? So even if you go very far back into celestial history, you have to reach a "beginning." Even though you may not believe in Eternity Past, we must go "there" to determine where the beginnings of these particles came from. Who ignited all this? You can't have "Nothing" creating "Something" which created particles which collided which created a Universe which included an Earth that somehow includes perfect 360-degree circles and lamb's wool and inner space looking like outer space and thousands of species of vegetation and stomachs in humans that contains acid to corrode metals but somehow doesn't consume itself.

So, tell me about the "beginning" from your worldview.

Thanks.

[CCordero]

Just kidding, I'm not a Muslim. I'm an atheist.

I was raised in Protestant Christianity and honestly believed the whole deal for most of my life. I attended Baptist churches, Churches of Christ, Methodist, Free Methodist, Four Square, Lutheran, Wesleyan, Catholic, Orthodox, and other denominations that I can't immediately remember.

Over the years, my doubts accumulated until one day I had to be honest with myself and admit that I just didn't believe in God any more. That was a good day for me.

Anyway, I'm not here to troll or harass anybody. I just like to debate, as the name Socrates should imply.

Also, your smilies sold me on registering. Look at this: This is great! I love these smilies!


edit: Perhaps I should say my top 5 is...

1. BIG
2. KRS-ONE
3. Nas
4. Scarface
5. Ghostface

Welcome to the boards. I'm mad familiar with atheism and grieve for the the atheistic worldview that I find futile. I love truth, hence I love debating when it is positive and productive. I take it that you stand for truth too because you love debating? If so, you can spark a thread and ask me any question you like.

[jnorman888]

Just kidding, I'm not a Muslim. I'm an atheist.

I was raised in Protestant Christianity and honestly believed the whole deal for most of my life. I attended Baptist churches, Churches of Christ, Methodist, Free Methodist, Four Square, Lutheran, Wesleyan, Catholic, Orthodox, and other denominations that I can't immediately remember.

Over the years, my doubts accumulated until one day I had to be honest with myself and admit that I just didn't believe in God any more. That was a good day for me.

Anyway, I'm not here to troll or harass anybody. I just like to debate, as the name Socrates should imply.

Also, your smilies sold me on registering. Look at this: This is great! I love these smilies!


edit: Perhaps I should say my top 5 is...

1. BIG
2. KRS-ONE
3. Nas
4. Scarface
5. Ghostface

Who are your top 5 non secular rap artists? Have you listenned to any stuff on HCR?










ICXC NIKA

[Socrates]

Who are your top 5 non secular rap artists?

You guys keep throwing around this word "secular" like anything that ain't marketed as Christian rap is secular. That just ain't right. There's a lot of Christian rappers who don't market their albums as "Christian music." Are they secular artists? You're falling prey to a marketing gimmick, I think.

Have you listenned to any stuff on HCR?

Put me on to anything good.

[CCordero]

You guys keep throwing around this word "secular" like anything that ain't marketed as Christian rap is secular. That just ain't right. There's a lot of Christian rappers who don't market their albums as "Christian music." Are they secular artists? You're falling prey to a marketing gimmick, I think..

Technically, hip hop is really not secular given the many religious themes in many rap songs. Secular simply means apart from religion.

In any case, have you dealt with your sins yet? Disobedience to God's laws is what has you as an atheist. One of the commandments of God is that you should not worship anything except YHWH. If you're not worshiping YHWH, you must then be worshiping something. Is that a correct assessment?