Tonex's 1st nterview since Naked Truth

[DJ Wade-O]

I am sure everyone will have their opinions of Tonex after listening to this, I just ask that you listen to the full interview, befor you make your mind up. Obviously, I still urge you to keep him, his family, those who stand beside him in ministry as well as his family in prayer.

www.myspace.com/wadeoradio

EDIT:

My bad ya'll. I gotta reload the show. It'll be up within the hour. Sorry.


EDIT Part 2:
Click here (http://www.switchpod.com/users/wade-o/ftp/wadeoradioepisode29.mp3) to listen ya'll

For a playlist of the show...CLICK HERE (http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=116262270&blogID=280055184&Mytoken=EE5E277D-AE16-4A28-AD742E4DA37DEE5B12245714)

[APPLEJAXX]

What is Nureau?

Laced in the fabric of the universe is the Lord's creative genius. Paul in Colossians 1:16 says that "for by Him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible...all things were created by Him and for Him."

In 1992, Tonéx received the vision for this new movement. I have been following the Nureaun Ink movement for years, and I was blessed with the opportunity to become a part of it in 2003.

The first night I arrived in San Diego was May of 2003. Working on lyrics can make a man hungry, so Tonéx and I went to Taco Fiesta and ordered chicken-rolled tacos. As soon as we arrived back at his home, we greeted the Queen (Ms. Tonéx) then Tonéx gave me a tour of the house. Then we sat in front of the flat screen and watched a throw-back tape of Tonéx directing the choir in 1992. I heard some futuristic choir music that churches are still not brave enough to do now in 2007. This goes to show that even though it's 2007, and people are just now experiencing the Nureau movement, God has been working through Tonéx and the Inkians for years.

Five years after the call, in 1997, Tonéx released the original version of Pronounced Toe-Nay. People finally caught a glimpse of the INK in that album. The album could not be placed in a specific music genre because it was hip-hop, retro, soul, jazz, and the futuristic all in one.

Several years later, in 2001, the album MSS Dynasty: Hostile Takeover (see album review) was released [on Tommy Boy Gospel]. The project provided encouragement: nuggets that gave society a taste of the Ink's creative technique.

Aside from music, Nureau is a lifestyle. James 1:22 says to "be doers of the word, and not hearers only". The Nureau culture is all about applying the principles revealed in the Bible to our lives. Along with the concepts from the Word, we have our own look, style, walk and even a glossary. Try going to the store and picking up some "teenage yogurt!"

The magnitude of innovation we all bring to the table is what makes the Nureau movement unique. Our different talents also define us as Nureaupeans. A Nureaupean is a citizen of Nureaumerica. We focus on the Lord and allow HIS creativity and power to flow through us.

Many people try to be carbon copies of what is current in pop or hip hop culture. Claiming to "strive for excellence" while imitating the very thing others do is not what we are about. We strive to step up the quality of our life and work so that our character, music, language, outlook, and ink spillage reflect Christ. We do this so we walk in total quality. We make trends and people follow us. With the mindset of expanding our inventive approach, we are pushed to rectify the dark clouds of deception shadowing over the world.

Nureau is NOT just music, NOT just language, NOT just a Japanese look Tonéx wears to the Stellar Awards, and NOT just a cereal-like name. Nureau is a culture. Nureau is a lifestyle focused on Christ, while at the same time, being creative in whatever form we are perfecting, in order to be lamps with oil that burn in a world that so desperately needs answers.

Kingdom Kulture Kool!!
~written by Applejaxx~

[Moody]

Does this Nureau post belong here?

Anyway, I downloaded the show and I'm listening to it right now.

All I gotta say is... I hear the brotha's heart, and honestly? Honestly? My view hasn't changed on him at all. Despite the cussing and language, I saw through it (before) and see where he is coming from more clearly now. Needless to say, I'm glad to know that Tonex isn't what half of yall was saying he was.

Dude needs prayer and encouragment... like we all do.

Furthermore, just an observation... those who've had to "deal with issues" (while being saved) will have a VERY DIFFERENT attitude toward brothas like Tonex vs. those who have not.

By the way, I love this line from him (paraphrased)

"THEY MAD AT ME BECAUSE I CUSSED, BUT THEY CUSS ME OUT WITH SCRIPTURES, NOT EVEN USING THE BIBLE TO RESTORE, BUT TO KILL"

That's real right there. Sums up my view on some of yall on this board.

Anyway, I'm praying for the brotha... not because I think he ain't saved. I'm praying for the brotha cuz I know what it's like to be born-again and to feel like you are lost still.

Yo, Wade-O, thanks for doing this and posting it!!!

[outrage]

Does this Nureau post belong here?



ahhh, yes

[DJ Wade-O]

I am loading it back up now guys. Should be ready in a few minutes. Again sorry for this.

Moody, thanks for the kinds words bro. I'd appreciate if you dont share that version of teh show with anyone. There were some audio issues involved with it.

[Moody]

No worries brotha, I got it on lock-down... :)

[JusThoughtZ]

Word@Moody.

We all strive for holiness. We all should strive to be truthful also.

Awesome job. Wade.

He said you came to him correct with it. I agree.

Imma keep it at that for peace's sake.

!HOLLA

[DJ Wade-O]

if ya'll can...pray for me real quick. I'm having audio issues with trying to get this thing up. :-(

[JusThoughtZ]

if ya'll can...pray for me real quick. I'm having audio issues with trying to get this thing up. :-(

gotcha fam.

[ZestD]

Does this Nureau post belong here?

Anyway, I downloaded the show and I'm listening to it right now.

All I gotta say is... I hear the brotha's heart, and honestly? Honestly? My view hasn't changed on him at all. Despite the cussing and language, I saw through it (before) and see where he is coming from more clearly now. Needless to say, I'm glad to know that Tonex isn't what half of yall was saying he was.

Dude needs prayer and encouragment... like we all do.

Furthermore, just an observation... those who've had to "deal with issues" (while being saved) will have a VERY DIFFERENT attitude toward brothas like Tonex vs. those who have not.

By the way, I love this line from him (paraphrased)

"THEY MAD AT ME BECAUSE I CUSSED, BUT THEY CUSS ME OUT WITH SCRIPTURES, NOT EVEN USING THE BIBLE TO RESTORE, BUT TO KILL"

That's real right there. Sums up my view on some of yall on this board.

Anyway, I'm praying for the brotha... not because I think he ain't saved. I'm praying for the brotha cuz I know what it's like to be born-again and to feel like you are lost still.

Yo, Wade-O, thanks for doing this and posting it!!!

Truest talk ever on this board...especially the bold part. We must remember to NOT used scripts as arrows and stones. Worry about your lust, greed, anger, etc like dremarshall alluded to in his locked "...booty..." thread.

[DJ Wade-O]

ok...i put the link up in the initial post. Sorry for the roller coaster ride ya'll.

Click here (www.switchpod.com/users/wade-o/ftp/wadeoradioepisode29.mp3)

[Moody]

Truest talk ever on this board...especially the bold part. We must remember to NOT used scripts as arrows and stones. Worry about your lust, greed, anger, etc like dremarshall alluded to in his locked "...booty..." thread.

You know, when I saw the locked "booty" thread, I knew EXACTLY what he was getting at, and I had to laugh a little about some of the responses. I'm like "okay, I just must be one of the few born-again Christians that has to deal with these types of things"

Interestingly enough, Tonex touched on the same mindset. I'll categorize it as "being born-again yet still finding out that you are a dawg without Christ".

Truth is, I'll put on my team a "struggling" Christian who is transparent than a "everything is good with me" Christian who is secretly dealing with issues. Why? Because I believe the "struggling" Christian (who is transparent) will be closer to realizing what God's grace is really about (and he will eventually be "cleaned up" and transparent)

There seems to be a lot of the latter nowadays. (I'm really not talking about messageboards either, so those of you who are all worked up because you think I'm taking a "shot" at you, get over it)

Its time that we become more transparent so that those outside the church (and inside) will see that 1) people struggle (for whatever the reason - sometimes bad circumstances, other times because of our disobedience) but 2) people can have victory in Christ because of the grace of God. And again... those who have gone through the process (and truly understands God's grace) will have a VERY DIFFERENT ATTITUDE towards cats like Tonex than those who have not.

So whatever you repond with (regarding Tonex's interview), ask yourself first this... what if you were in Tonex's shoes? What would you have done in his situation? Would you have "lashed" out as he did? Would you have responded differently? When you've come to your conclusion, then ask yourself... "What has God saved me from?"

If you answer "He has not only saved me from Sin, but from MYSELF"... you understand, and you will have a response tempered with a lot more love and understanding (because you've been there) vs. "this brotha ain't saved, blah, blah, blah."

Lastly, please don't mis-interpret what I'm saying as giving folks a license to act a fool (or having an un-repentive heart). That is not what I'm talking about. But what I am talking about is people who have acted a fool... while born-again, yet God saved them from their foolishness and by the time He was done with them, they are like "Yes, Jesus! I can see now! Thank you, thank you, thank you!"

“Have mercy on me, O God, according to your unfailing love; according to your great compassion blot out my transgressions.” Ps 51:1

I guess I could have summed everything up as this:

Those who have been forgiven a lot love a lot. The longer I walk this earth as a Christian, the more this phrase becomes real to me. I thank God that He has saved me from my folly, and I thank Him that no matter where Tonex goes, He has him in His hand, and the brotha will come out of this transformed even more into the image of Christ... because He is a good Father.

With this said, this will be the last post from me (for awhile) on the board. Got some new projects to work on and I need to be spending more time in the Word. If you want to holla for whateve reason, feel free to hit me up on the PM.

Lastly, I leave you with this...

2 Corinthians 9:8
And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that always having all sufficiency in everything, you may have an abundance for every good deed.

Much blessings to all of you, in the name of the Lord Jesus!

In Christ,
Stephen Moody

[JusThoughtZ]

You know, when I saw the locked "booty" thread, I knew EXACTLY what he was getting at, and I had to laugh a little about some of the responses. I'm like "okay, I just must be one of the few born-again Christians that has to deal with these types of things"

Interestingly enough, Tonex touched on the same mindset. I'll categorize it as "being born-again yet still finding out that you are a dawg without Christ".

Truth is, I'll put on my team a "struggling" Christian who is transparent than a "everything is good with me" Christian who is secretly dealing with issues. Why? Because I believe the "struggling" Christian (who is transparent) will be closer to realizing what God's grace is really about (and he will eventually be "cleaned up" and transparent)

There seems to be a lot of the latter nowadays. (I'm really not talking about messageboards either, so those of you who are all worked up because you think I'm taking a "shot" at you, get over it)

Its time that we become more transparent so that those outside the church (and inside) will see that 1) people struggle (for whatever the reason - sometimes bad circumstances, other times because of our disobedience) but 2) people can have victory in Christ because of the grace of God. And again... those who have gone through the process (and truly understands God's grace) will have a VERY DIFFERENT ATTITUDE towards cats like Tonex than those who have not.

So whatever you repond with (regarding Tonex's interview), ask yourself first this... what if you were in Tonex's shoes? What would you have done in his situation? Would you have "lashed" out as he did? Would you have responded differently? When you've come to your conclusion, then ask yourself... "What has God saved me from?"

If you answer "He has not only saved me from Sin, but from MYSELF"... you understand, and you will have a response tempered with a lot more love and understanding (because you've been there) vs. "this brotha ain't saved, blah, blah, blah."

Lastly, please don't mis-interpret what I'm saying as giving folks a license to act a fool (or having an un-repentive heart). That is not what I'm talking about. But what I am talking about is people who have acted a fool... while born-again, yet God saved them from their foolishness and by the time He was done with them, they are like "Yes, Jesus! I can see now! Thank you, thank you, thank you!"

“Have mercy on me, O God, according to your unfailing love; according to your great compassion blot out my transgressions.” Ps 51:1

I guess I could have summed everything up as this:

Those who have been forgiven a lot love a lot. The longer I walk this earth as a Christian, the more this phrase becomes real to me. I thank God that He has saved me from my folly, and I thank Him that no matter where Tonex goes, He has him in His hand, and the brotha will come out of this transformed even more into the image of Christ... because He is a good Father.

With this said, this will be the last post from me (for awhile) on the board. Got some new projects to work on and I need to be spending more time in the Word. If you want to holla for whateve reason, feel free to hit me up on the PM.

Lastly, I leave you with this...

2 Corinthians 9:8
And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that always having all sufficiency in everything, you may have an abundance for every good deed.

Much blessings to all of you, in the name of the Lord Jesus!

In Christ,
Stephen Moody

Bro what is your aim/yahoo/myspace?

Thank Q. Maybe they will hear it from you....

[4Sight Sounds]

...well, one thing I'll admit....I do have a few 4 letter words rolling around in my mouth right now.....you said it right Wade-O....surreal.

[nygurl]

The show won't upload for me :(

[joseph29]

i just got done listening to the show, and i'm literally speechless. And I'm not an emotional dude, but i had tears in my eyes near the end of that joint.

[JusThoughtZ]

i just got done listening to the show, and i'm literally speechless. And I'm not an emotional dude, but i had tears in my eyes near the end of that joint.

haha you too ?

[joseph29]

yo that interview was just hard hitting. All i can say is pray for Wade-O and Tonex, cuz God is gonna use those cats in a powerful way.

[JusThoughtZ]

yo that interview was just hard hitting. All i can say is pray for Wade-O and Tonex, cuz God is gonna use those cats in a powerful way.

WORD...and....WORD!

[Elekt]

I listened to the whole thing

and I find it good that he is not looking for cats to agree with him so much that they miss his cry for help....he is looking for people to see his heart and see his pain and he is looking to the church to help restore a brother of the faith.

[KFB]

Powerful.....

[DJ Links]

I listened to the whole thing

and I find it good that he is not looking for cats to agree with him so much that they miss his cry for help....he is looking for people to see his heart and see his pain and he is looking to the church to help restore a brother of the faith.

Exactly. I want to say something to your last few words but I'll keep silent.

[illuminaticx]

Can you just post the Tonex interview.. This is much more important than music.. I can't skip through to get to the interview. I DON'T WANT to peep the whole show with music.. Just the important part with Tonex sharing what's on his heart. Thankx..

J =]

[nygurl]

Wow...Im speechless

[BondServant]

I listened to it, and honestly feel the same way that I felt when this whole topic began. I was never trippin of his choice of words, but the God he serves.

Wade, did you ask him about the Trinity, I didn't hear it, but perhaps you asked off the air?


Or is the nature of the Godhead something that should be the least of our concern?

[Kerry1914]

I think Larosa mentioned that he talked to Applejaxx and AJ said that Tonex does believe in the Trinity.

Still listening..... I'll reserve my response for a YouTube video. I hear all the stuff he's been going through and the hurt behind it, but that still doesn't excuse the language OR the approach. Bad day or not, believers are NEW creations and we're commanded to respond differently.

But I'm still listening.

[BondServant]

I think Larosa mentioned that he talked to Applejaxx and AJ said that Tonex does believe in the Trinity.


Yeah, and I still would like to know how that could be if he resides over a PAW congregation. He'd have to adhere to Oneness theology wouldn't he?

[DJ KriTiKul]

I'm getting quite frustrated. I can't find the song anywhere. Can anybody help me out? I'd like to better understand the controversy by hearing the song for myself.

[C-dero]

The error that Tonex is commiting is equating being honest/blunt/ with being true or speaking truth.

More on that later but I am still listening...

[C-dero]

Also the cliche, " Thats real talk" or "keep it Real" seems like a license to offend people and sin.

[C-dero]

Also, I know, I know, it seems like all I am doing is being critical right?

But check it, it seems like Tonex is saying something when he really is saying nothing deep. It a nutshell, his argument or justification for "nacked Truth" is that since no one is perfect, then lets be imperfect. Since people lust in their hearts, we should therefore lust openly or since the way I feel has me saying some bad stuff in my mind, or picturing something bad, then I need to wear it on my sleeves.

That is bugged thinking? The point is that its sin! Whether I sin in my mind where only God knows it or whether I sin in front of others, the point is that as a Christian, I need to repent from my sin. I need to stop doing that which offends God. So, what makes Tonex public actions any justifiable then his private actions? The difference is that when know one knows, you still have God to deal with and when it goes public, you have a civil duty to correct the situation. If Tonex is correct in what he is saying, then what is the set up of Government for? Is it not to prevent people from acting on their feelings? Yes! Teh Government exist so that Tonex, me, or whoever, will not commit an offense that may have started in our minds. Feel me?

[Deadmanwalking]

Also the cliche, " Thats real talk" or "keep it Real" seems like a license to offend people and sin.

Yeah man, I always get the remark from young people: "I feel like I'm being fake". I alway have to tell them, you're not being fake by keeping it under control. You're being fake if you act like it doesn't exist.

I understand why he did it, but I still don't grasp why he did it the way he did it.


Either way, in a strange way, i've come to the conclusion that God is sovereign. It's almost as if this had to happen, and as a result he will be stronger for it. Sometimes we gotta get broken down before we can be built up strong the way are supposed to be.


Just some thoughts.


Pc.

[C-dero]

Yeah man, I always get the remark from young people: "I feel like I'm being fake". I alway have to tell them, you're not being fake by keeping it under control. You're being fake if you act like it doesn't exist.

I understand why he did it, but I still don't grasp why he did it the way he did it.


Either way, in a strange way, i've come to the conclusion that God is sovereign. It's almost as if this had to happen, and as a result he will be stronger for it. Sometimes we gotta get broken down before we can be built up strong the way are supposed to be.


Just some thoughts.


Pc.

Nahh, I won't ever ever look at it as something that God is using for his own good since its always in the context of being persecuted by others. When people sin against you it is worked out for good. When you sin, its never good.

The dude is bitter. He has gotten hurt by people. He is upset as certain things. But bitterness is whats in him and that leads to all crazy sins.

He is an angry dude and in our society today, especially in hip hop, that is praised. Being angry is "keeping it real." However, scripture tells us to stay away from angry folks.


"make no friendship with an angry man, and with a furious man do not go, lest you learn his ways, and set a snare for your soul" (Prov. 22:24-25).

Proverbs 29:20

Do you see a man who is hasty in his words?
There is more hope for a fool than for him.

[Devin]

i know dude might have been hurt.but ummmm...cant he just get over it?:rolleyes:

[C-dero]

This brother in Christ is not making it easy for cats to feel him. So if someone brings out scripture that means they are cussing him out? What does this cat do with Cain and Abel when God was like, "Cain, I know what you thinking, don't even try it!" (paraphrase). If Tonex is right, God should of been, Like, " Cain, Man, I feel you homey! You was just keeping it real loc, Abel got you mad and you were thinking bad tsuff and rather than holding back, you simply let Abel have it, I feel you dog!" NO! God was not having it and God warned him to not act on his thoughts. It was still bad but he made it worst!

Tonex is equating sin in the heart with realized sin. They are not the same, hence there is government to keep sin from becoming crimes, hence, God did not want Cain to kill able, what Cain was thinking!


BTW, for those who are about to let me have it. Yes I am praying for him.

[C-dero]

i know dude might have been hurt.but ummmm...cant he just get over it?:rolleyes:

not like that he won't. He is making it worst for him.

[apokalum]

11 minutes in apokalum presses the little "X" in the top-right of windows media player. :no:

[Deadmanwalking]

Nahh, I won't ever ever look at it as something that God is using for his own good since its always in the context of being persecuted by others. When people sin against you it is worked out for good. When you sin, its never good.

The dude is bitter. He has gotten hurt by people. He is upset as certain things. But bitterness is whats in him and that leads to all crazy sins.

He is an angry dude and in our society today, especially in hip hop, that is praised. Being angry is "keeping it real." However, scripture tells us to stay away from angry folks.


"make no friendship with an angry man, and with a furious man do not go, lest you learn his ways, and set a snare for your soul" (Prov. 22:24-25).

Proverbs 29:20

Do you see a man who is hasty in his words?
There is more hope for a fool than for him.


Ouch!!! Lol. It's hard to argue with scripture.

But, let's say that dude really does love God,(which I believe he does) then rom 8:28 would apply to him the way it applies to us. All things, not some things. God can use all things... I know this from experience. You do too. So did Paul.

I believe that he can come back better than before if he humbles himself and listen to what the word says opposed to what he wants it to say. For years it seems as though he's kinds mixed his desires and ideologies with scripture and built a wall with a mixture of weak and strong mortar. That's what I mean when I say, you gotta break down to build up. He's gotta let go of what he wishes it was, what he thinks it should be, and accept what it is and what the scripture say it is. He has to accept that he messed up. No more rationalizing. The scriptures say...you do. He needs to re-adapt his standards to what scripture holds is to. That's all. Nothing unlike any of us have had to do.

Musically, he's never been for me. But even still I got hope for the dude. I got a lot of hope for his restoration.

[C-dero]

DJ Wade, Truth's My testimony was very fitting.

[C-dero]

Ouch!!! Lol. It's hard to argue with scripture.

But, let's say that dude really does love God,(which I believe he does) then rom 8:28 would apply to him the way it applies to us. All things, not some things. God can use all things... I know this from experience. You do too. So did Paul.

I believe that he can come back better than before if he humbles himself and listen to what the word says opposed to what he wants it to say. For years it seems as though he's kinds mixed his desires and ideologies with scripture and built a wall with a mixture of weak and strong mortar. That's what I mean when I say, you gotta break down to build up. He's gotta let go of what he wishes it was, what he thinks it should be, and accept what it is and what the scripture say it is. He has to accept that he messed up. No more rationalizing. The scriptures say...you do. He needs to re-adapt his standards to what scripture holds is to. That's all. Nothing unlike any of us have had to do.

Musically, he's never been for me. But even still I got hope for the dude. I got a lot of hope for his restoration.

Oh, I don't judge his position with God. I am judging his argument.


About God getting glory from "Naked Truth" God will get the Glory regardless but that is not always a good thing for us. God gets glory from condemning people in hell.


In any case, Peep Tonex and compare it with David's confession. Very different right?


Tonex, if you are reading this, please my brother, David, the Model king, committed adultery. He kept it real by acting out what he felt in his heart. He ended up killing his homey. I believe that his confession is a model of how we should respond to our sins. He was broken before God, not just hurt. You spoke about having a contrite heart and a broken spirit. Please, continue to seek God for forgiveness with the intent to repent from not only our sins, but repent from allowing pain to rule in our hearts. We have all been hurt before, but the purpose for pain, is to built Character, not to destroy it. Your song, "Make Me Over," is a song that we all sing in different ways.

I hope you don't see my comments as an attack on you but on your argument. I am not only communicating to you but also to the board. You know Tonex, you and I and others on here are models of Christian lively-hood. It is scary that there are people that we have mad influence on that will do what we do. I met you waaay back when you was coming up. I don't expect you to remember me. Please b, allow the Lord to absorb your pain for you and allow him to speak for you. One!

[DJ Official]

Cruz,

Your last post was beautifully said. When I got saved his cd was the 1st r&b album that I listened to and loved. I'm pulling for the brother and pray he does get restored (trust me I am). But at the same time as people who are in the forefront (in many times pastors even) we really gotta be careful what we say in public. Many people will follow our actions and even take it further. Jerry Bridges quotes an old well known verse in his book "Pursuit Of Holiness"

Sow a thought, reap an act
Sow an act, reap a habit
Sow a habit, reap a character.

I pray that his and our thoughts will be the thoughts of the GOD who saved us. Much love to all and "Run in such a way as to get the prize" 1 Cor 9:24

[God's Elect]

Wade O, brotha I just thank God for your humble spirit in just reaching out to brotha Tonex. Love your show, I know God has a great work for you fam!! More to come! Bro Tonex is going thru a trial season, it will pass, deff will keep him lifted!

Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness

[JARZJR]

:unsure: Wow... Wade, i'd like to see a copy of the message you sent him invitin him on the show...

[Kerry1914]

Also, I know, I know, it seems like all I am doing is being critical right?

But check it, it seems like Tonex is saying something when he really is saying nothing deep. It a nutshell, his argument or justification for "nacked Truth" is that since no one is perfect, then lets be imperfect. Since people lust in their hearts, we should therefore lust openly or since the way I feel has me saying some bad stuff in my mind, or picturing something bad, then I need to wear it on my sleeves.

That is bugged thinking? The point is that its sin! Whether I sin in my mind where only God knows it or whether I sin in front of others, the point is that as a Christian, I need to repent from my sin. I need to stop doing that which offends God. So, what makes Tonex public actions any justifiable then his private actions? The difference is that when know one knows, you still have God to deal with and when it goes public, you have a civil duty to correct the situation. If Tonex is correct in what he is saying, then what is the set up of Government for? Is it not to prevent people from acting on their feelings? Yes! Teh Government exist so that Tonex, me, or whoever, will not commit an offense that may have started in our minds. Feel me?

CrossLamb, you nailed it right here.

People ARE using the excuse of 'real talk' and simply saying whatever's on their mind as an excuse to sin.

But God's commands to be holy and to exhibit godly behavior are not based on how we feel. That's the point a lot of folks have tried to get across to Tonex, even though they may not have said it this way.

People forget - anger is a choice. The same way we can be ticked off at someone one minute, and then chose to stifle and muffle that anger the next minute when we don't wanna appear 'wrathful' in front of someone else, shows that we CAN exhibit some self-control over ourselves and our reactions to things.

Ephesians 4:26 tells believers that there IS a place for anger, but in our anger, DO NOT SIN. That COMMANDMENT OF GOD (not of men) supercedes any catch phrases by M.C. Breed (Ain't no future in your frontin'). The whole 'letting it out' thing is not the biblical way to handle anger. It's actually taken from evolutionary psychology and psychotherapy - not the scriptures. And it's WRONG.

Unlike the non-believer who has a 'bad day' and decides to curse, believers are told that the fruit of the Spirit is SELF-CONTROL AND HOLINESS in Galatians 5. That includes our speech as well as our physical actions.

We already been down the 'it takes deliberate thought to blah blah blah' lane. The brother is obviously and RIGHTLY hurting because people slandered his name. But what he's done by cursing and not being repentant about it and calling it what it is - SIN - is simply made all the people who told lies about him - appear to be telling the truth in some sense. And he can sling all the clichés about 'They ain't stoppin' this' around as much as he likes, they still will not erase the bad reputation that he has garnered for himself here - at least not in the immediate future.

But worse than that, his language - both on the track and also in how he handled himself on the interview - doesn't say humility, doesn't say Christ-likeness, doesn't say repentance..... and worst of all, doesn't say GOD.

Let me make this point. One of Tonex's major gripes here is that people slandered his name, and therefore, he was unable to get work, and more and more things kept goin' bad for him.

And to that, I answer..... SO ? That still doesn't give you the right to 'blow up'. Even if they came in, robbed your house and called you names TO YOUR FACE, that doesn't give you the right to cuss them out, cuss in frustration or revile them for their deeds against you.

Before you jump in and tell me to 'live that', let me tell you something - I have. It's John 13:1-17 and 15:20 all over again. And dealing with some people on this board, it's a lesson I have to KEEP learning and KEEP falling on my face before God about.

The God of the Universe - who alone is worthy of worship and every HIGH honor and word you can ever speak - came down to earth, took on human flesh, humbled Himself and did not respond with cursing and bitterness when men WRONGLY called Him all sorts of names. This is Phil. 2:1-8. We talk a lot about humility, but it's most clearly exemplified HERE. He says that we'll go through these sorts of persecutions, where people speak wrongly of us.

WHO DO WE THINK WE ARE TO THINK THAT WE HAVE THE 'RIGHT' TO 'KEEP IT REAL' ? Christ didn't revile back. Being truly Christlike means you have to DIE to your so-called 'rights' (Luke 9:23-26). Deny yourself. Oh, they keep pressin' me and pressin' me....Imma eventually blow up!

Deny yourself.

If you're truly a child of God, act like it and stop making excuses for your sin.

PERIOD.

Now.....

What the brother needs to do is this - and I know he's probably reading and if I get a break, I'll probably turn this post into a YouTube video....

Repent. Call sin what it is - sin. It's not 'keepin' it real'. The scriptures, in Romans 6 and 7, don't tell the believer to treat sin like it doesn't exist and call that holiness. Rather, it tells believers to reign in sin and gain control over it so that though it does exist, we don't let it control us. So brother, on behalf of all the people prayin' for you, call your sin what it is - SIN. And TURN from it. Turn from this pattern of behavior as a lifestyle, turn from thinking you have to defend yourself by writin' and cussin' about it, just TURN from it. Period.

Turn to Christ. Trust in Him to resolve the situations and the circumstances and to CHANGE YOUR REACTION to the things around you. Psalm 119 is a beautiful Psalm and has (upon several readings) continued to change my life. Spend some time in the book of James looking at the book in context - Christian living. What should a Christian life look like ? Emulate this. 1 John as well.

And I know you struggle, just like we all do, with the urge to blast people who come at you - either personally or 'overall' (as you stated your response was to 'church culture'). But that's not how we're commanded to respond when persecution, lies and wrongdoing come our way. And when those ways that we have set ourselves into come up, don't pass it off as 'seasons'. Season or not, sin is still sin and there's no excuse for it. Don't try to hide it or justify it by saying it's your season.

Sin IS that serious because God's holiness IS that serious. Sin put Christ on the cross. Your 'season' put the Christ you love on the cross. My 'season' put the Christ I love on the cross. My lost temper on HCR put Christ on the cross. ________ 's veiled insults put Christ on the cross. The people who spread lies about you - their sins put Christ on the cross.

It's not a light issue. The start of your interview, you cited the scriptures in part - Without Holiness no one will see God. What the scriptures FULLY say is "Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord. See to it that no one fails to obtain the grace of God; that no "root of bitterness" springs up and causes trouble, and by it many become defiled;" (Hebrews 12:14-15).

Brother, you've been hanging onto a root of bitterness you need to let go. And the more you focus on you, the more you will find your thoughts and life corrupted. I've BEEN THERE. And the writer of Hebrews knows it too - which is why we are commanded to STRIVE FOR holiness - not just peace with everyone.

Make this your prayer today brother. That God change those things in you that need to be changed so that His glory may shine forth and His holiness may be seen in your life.

Know that many are praying for your repentance and return, myself included. Humble yourself and let God exalt you at the right time.

Grace and Peace
KG

[Deadmanwalking]

Oh, I don't judge his position with God. I am judging his argument.


About God getting glory from "Naked Truth" God will get the Glory regardless but that is not always a good thing for us. God gets glory from condemning people in hell.




In any case, Peep Tonex and compare it with David's confession. Very different right?


Tonex, if you are reading this, please my brother, David, the Model king, committed adultery. He kept it real by acting out what he felt in his heart. He ended up killing his homey. I believe that his confession is a model of how we should respond to our sins. He was broken before God, not just hurt. You spoke about having a contrite heart and a broken spirit. Please, continue to seek God for forgiveness with the intent to repent from not only our sins, but repent from allowing pain to rule in our hearts. We have all been hurt before, but the purpose for pain, is to built Character, not to destroy it. Your song, "Make Me Over," is a song that we all sing in different ways.

I hope you don't see my comments as an attack on you but on your argument. I am not only communicating to you but also to the board. You know Tonex, you and I and others on here are models of Christian lively-hood. It is scary that there are people that we have mad influence on that will do what we do. I met you waaay back when you was coming up. I don't expect you to remember me. Please b, allow the Lord to absorb your pain for you and allow him to speak for you. One!

Word.

[kingsman2ki]

Ya'll are not listening.. still.

The point of the interview was not about he wrong or he right,
It's about Tonex being restored... bottomline.

Yeah, He said he is wrong for cussing however he knows and realize his sin and wants and desire to be restored...

We should be focused in on praying for Tonex, not only Tonex but others(like Tonex says brothers and sisters thats coming into the kingdom that don't know about reformed, charismatic, pentacostal,etc.. doctrine and frankly don't care) that just want Jesus Christ and to know him in Spirit and in Truth...

As long as we don't discern spiritually the person and stop being so quick to tell people the obvious wrong they doing, and get to the root, we'll be stagnated having a form of Godliness denying the power thereof....


People, The Hoy Spirit is not just in you to put you in the body of Christ. He is what the bible says in John 14:25-26

"These things have I spoken unto you, being [yet] present with you."

"But the Comforter, [which is] the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you."

Don't be so quick to correct and rebuke somebody, listen and bear your brother burdens with them. and when the Spirit gives you the go ahead to speak then speak...

it's not all about who's right and who's wrong.. We gotta mature family.

[4Sight Sounds]

honest question.....

Based on the public interview, what evidence is there that Tonex has repented?

I really do hope that he does.....I know he is still hurt. I hope that he gets past it. As Cruz mentioned earlier, Cane didn't get past his....and the result was horrible.

[kingsman2ki]

honest question.....

Based on the public interview, what evidence is there that Tonex has repented?

I really do hope that he does.....I know he is still hurt. I hope that he gets past it. As Cruz mentioned earlier, Cane didn't get past his....and the result was horrible.

But who says he hasn't repented for what was done. He said in the interview that he said he was sorry for what was said and he doesn't want anybody else doing it the way he didn't it..

So, would you constitute that as repenting?

[4Sight Sounds]

But who says he hasn't repented for what was done. He said in the interview that he said he was sorry for what was said and he doesn't want anybody else doing it the way he didn't it..

So, would you constitute that as repenting?

Not trying to start an arguement or anything, but repentance means to turn away from the sin you've been convicted of...

What evidence is there that Tonex, at this point, has turned away from expressing himself the way he did in the song? Not that I need evidence, but for his sake before God...

...once again, I ask in sincerity.... what part of that interview indicated a turning away from his mode of communication in The Naked Truth?

[dogfight!]

1Brothers, if someone is caught in a sin, you who are spiritual should restore him gently. But watch yourself, or you also may be tempted. 2Carry each other's burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ. 3If anyone thinks he is something when he is nothing, he deceives himself. 4Each one should test his own actions. Then he can take pride in himself, without comparing himself to somebody else, 5for each one should carry his own load.
Can't argue w/scripture.

[loercase]

But who says he hasn't repented for what was done. He said in the interview that he said he was sorry for what was said and he doesn't want anybody else doing it the way he didn't it..

So, would you constitute that as repenting?

I don't know. Wade asked him if he would do it (the song) again and Tonex thought about and said he would if he was feeling the same way. Repentance isn't saying saying I'm sorry, it's turning away from sin. In a nutshell, it's actually not do it again.

In this respect... I can't judge dude cause there is stuff that I have to stop doing myself. But that in itself does not change the fact that he and I both are sinning.

Be Blessed

[Zee]

To Tonex:

Hey Bro, hopefully one day you'll breeze past this post, man. Just wanted to let you know that I love you, man, and I'm praying for you. I know you'll make it through this. I'm not saying that I agree with everything, but that doesn't mean I still can't care or love you. Nor does it make me any better than you. Above all, I certainly won't allow it to cause me to bad mouth you!

Peep this song of mine called "You're Not Alone." I pray that it encourages you.

http://www.thezeesite.com/audio/yourenotalone.mp3

In Christ,

Your brother Zee

Edit: if you ever want to chop it up, hit me up on my myspace: www.myspace.com/zeemyspace (http://www.myspace.com/zeemyspace)

[DJ Links]

Props to the fam on this board that have spit biblical truth about how Tonex should have handled himself and should handle himself going forward, but I really wonder if we really listened to him.

Did many of us LISTEN to what our brother was saying. Did we take the time hear his heart before readying a response. I am convinced that listening is a lost ark in these days and times. So many of us almost immediately have a response ready after only hearing a few words of something that someone says to us.

I wonder if we forget that we are human sometimes on HCR and with our humanity subject to different emotions and life challenges. The bible is replete with examples of mankinds fallibility and constant short comings. Our brother cussed yes. Was it right no, but it's what came from the brother after going through a divorce, being sued for a million dollars by his record company, loosing 6 family members one being his father in less than a years time and on top of that being slandered. I wonder if after going through all of this how many scripts would have come out of our mouths at any given moment in time. Tonex clearly knows how he said things were wrong but what he felt was what he felt. Because we are christian now are we do deny our emotions? I say no, but we are admonished to keep them in check; however couple that with us being humans and that equals we aren't going to get it right all the time. He clearly said that what is did is not to advocate others sinning its just what he felt. How many of us have had some prayer times with God where we just let it all hang out. Times where we pull off our masks and become naked and unashamed before God. Truth be told I have had those moments and in those moments I cussed during prayer because what I was going through I didn't know any other way to articulate it. Did God reject me as His child because I cussed while praying? No. He lovingly and gently dealt with me and I repented of how I said things and certain words I have used.

Please fam we can't loose sight of our brother and the pain he is going through. We can't be callous because pain isn't new to the human experience and we all go through it. We have to walk with our brother and restore him. Throwing a bunch of scriptures over a message board right at this moment in my opinion isn't really going to do anything for him. He needs someone to walk with him through this process of pain he is currently going through. Honestly let's ask ourselves this question..........

If someone where to die in your immediately family that you were extremely close to due to some circumstances that were out of their hands to prevent; how would you want someone to react to you in your pain?

I can almost guarantee you during that time just having someone around and their presence being there speaks volumes and can testify of God's love towards you. Sure you can share scripts but you really aren't hearing what is said because of the pain you are going through. Maybe after you have had some time to process the pain will those scriptures come back to rememberance and bring even more comfort to you.

Here is a personal example.

My wife an I were expecting our first and everything was going great. Wifey went in for a checkup and had to be rushed to the hospital because her bloodpressure was in stroke range yet she said she never felt better. I got called to the hospital and what I thought would be an overnight experience turned into almost a week. It wasn't anything the docs hadn't seen before but it was serious nonetheless. Wifey and I were admitted to the high risk pregnancy ward and I am steadly there telling the docs that God would bring us through this, that they were going to see a miracle, etc. That went on for a couple of days.

On the 3rd day I was still telling the docs and the nurses that God was going to bring us through this, etc. Shoot on that 3rd night we shared the gospel with a young lady and led her to the Lord. Everything had seemed to stablize with wifeys blood pressure, fetal heart tone was good and everything. It looked as if my wife was going to be released and I decided to go home for the night after sleeping in the hospital for the past couple of days.

I came back the next morning and went to my wifes room to find and empty bed. I was frantic; where was my wife only to finid out from one of the nurses that during the night they were unable to get a fetal heart tone and that my child was dead. I don't know what emotions rushed through me when I heard that, I just wanted to see my wife. The nurse took me to my wife where she had just taken an ultrasound to confirm my son's death and the first thing that did was hug her and squeeze her and out of no where I said "We are still going to serve God!!". Thats not the end of the story. My wife still had to deliver our child and during the process of the docs giving my wife drugs to induce labor she almost died. At that point I because angry I mean really angry and hurt. The hospital chaplin pulled me in the room and I just started to pour my heart out to her and all of a sudden in the midst of my anger a peace came over me. Litterally the Peace of God that passed all my understanding was covering me like a blanket. Even in the midst of that I was still angry but His peace never left me. It was in moment that I knew everything was going to be ok. And it was later that afternoon as she finally delevired Judah Benonai which meansI praise God for the son of my sorrow.

I learned that day that during the emotional rollercoasters and pain that we go through that God never ever leaves us. That was the first time ever in my life that death walked into my household so close to me. What brought me and my wife through that was ultimately God and friends and family that were there for us and praying for us. They were not spitting scripts AT us but they were embodying scripture with their presence. Truth be told prayer was out the window for me and wifey. Pain was dwelling amoung us. So I say that to say this. If you aren't able to walk with Tonex simply pray for him. Don't discount the power of prayer!!! I pray that God walks with Tonex through this pain and doesn't allow any root of bitterness to take root. Let's stop analyzing dude (we know what sayeth the scripts and he does too) and pray and let also not discount his pain cause its real. As we pray with him and someone is there to walk with Tonex God will restore him no doubt at all.

Tonex I got love for you fam. I know the pain is real. I know the hurt is real, but what is able to supercede our pain is God's ability to bring healing and wholeness to us. He'll do it for you fam. I got ya!! He's got ya!!!!

Links

[C-dero]

Lord, we continue to pray for our brother Tonex. Lord, we appeal to your mercy and grace and your victorious power for living! Soak out the bitterness in Tonex's heart. You have told us in your word that bitterness leads to many sins. I pray that he will be delivered from the bitterness that has him under control. I pray that he will walk in the Spirit so that he may not fulfill the deeds of the flesh! Allow him to know that outside of your will and ways, its a dog eat dog world. Lord, our post-garden experience has shown us that a world that subtracts you out of any aspect of life is a world of judgementalism, selfishness, pride, abuse, sorrow, hopelessness, unhappiness, and it hurts that at times these fruits of sin can be found within the body of Christ. We prey lord for healing, spiritual healing! Emotional healing! Mental healing! We also pray that you will chastise your son for the bitterness that he is bowing to. We pray for restorative discipline otherwise he will be consumed by anger and loose his soul! I pray that someone will come his way over there in Cali to listen to him, love him, but to also be stern and sharp with words that cut like a surgical knife with aim to bring healing!


Thank you for hearing our prayers!

[DJ Links]

Lord, we continue to pray for our brother Tonex. Lord, we appeal to your mercy and grace and your victorious power for living! Soak out the bitterness in Tonex's heart. You have told us in your word that bitterness leads to many sins. I pray that he will be delivered from the bitterness that has him under control. I pray that he will walk in the Spirit so that he may not fulfill the deeds of the flesh! Allow him to know that outside of your will and ways, its a dog eat dog world. Lord, our post-garden experience has shown us that a world that subtracts you out of any aspect of life is a world of judgementalism, selfishness, pride, abuse, sorrow, hopelessness, unhappiness, and it hurts that at times these fruits of sin can be found within the body of Christ. We prey lord for healing, spiritual healing! Emotional healing! Mental healing! We also pray that you will chastise your son for the bitterness that he is bowing to. We pray for restorative discipline otherwise he will be consumed by anger and loose his soul! I pray that someone will come his way over there in Cali to listen to him, love him, but to also be stern and sharp with words that cut like a surgical knife with aim to bring healing!


Thank you for hearing our prayers!


Amen!!

[CHEMAelMC]

A yo, in this interview Tonex reminded me of our brother Pchild (what up, P, I got love for you bro!).. that whenever he post some controversial stuff everybody starts throwin' rocks at him, instead of keep him uplifted in prayer..

Yo, should we tell cats that are criticizin' Tonex to listen to the interview?... or will it only add fuel to the fire??

God bless you

--Chema

[JusThoughtZ]

Yo, should we tell cats that are criticizin' Tonex to listen to the interview?... or will it only add fuel to the fire??


Let be. God will see to it that everything will unfold as it should.

Human interference will only hinder the process.

[eyesofphaith]

Also, I know, I know, it seems like all I am doing is being critical right?

But check it, it seems like Tonex is saying something when he really is saying nothing deep. It a nutshell, his argument or justification for "nacked Truth" is that since no one is perfect, then lets be imperfect. Since people lust in their hearts, we should therefore lust openly or since the way I feel has me saying some bad stuff in my mind, or picturing something bad, then I need to wear it on my sleeves.

That is bugged thinking? The point is that its sin! Whether I sin in my mind where only God knows it or whether I sin in front of others, the point is that as a Christian, I need to repent from my sin. I need to stop doing that which offends God. So, what makes Tonex public actions any justifiable then his private actions? The difference is that when know one knows, you still have God to deal with and when it goes public, you have a civil duty to correct the situation. If Tonex is correct in what he is saying, then what is the set up of Government for? Is it not to prevent people from acting on their feelings? Yes! Teh Government exist so that Tonex, me, or whoever, will not commit an offense that may have started in our minds. Feel me?





Tonex obviously snapped. When we snap as humans we sometimes justify the unjustifiable in the midst of our anger and in his case bitterness. "I don't care", "you think I don't know that, I'm human what do you expect". I'm sure we've all said something similar to those examples if not any of those exactly. Even after becoming a member of the body of Christ. I heard tonex in one breathe say he shouldn't have expressed himself in that way (let's be real he's also said it through his actions: the song isn't up anymore so obviously there's some conviction in the consciense) and then he says if he had a chance to do it over again he'd do it the same way if he felt that way. Of course the thing is he doesn't need to feel that way which is and was bitter. Alot of times when we are bitter our emotions are all over the place, we are unsure of alot of things, we are confused.


I truly believe Tonex believes he is wrong and knew he was wrong while he was cursing on Wade-O's interview yet was still doing it. Why? Bitterness doesn't care. And guess what? He knows he's bitter, that's the great part. I took from what he said he know's he needs to deal with it and is dealing with it. As he kept saying "real talk": Tonex knows he's wrong in becoming bitter, acting out on the bitterness (which is a hard thing not to do, if you've never been bitter before you don't understand), getting on Wade-O show and cursing and carrying on at certain points of the interview the way he did (Romans 7) He acknowledges the conflict, I don't take it that he feels comfortable in his sin at all. I take from his interview he knows he needs rebuke, has recieved some and is taking heed to it.

I do believe he is a broken fountain and needs to be healed to the point he is able to yield his tongue to Gods Spirit. I believe God could be teaching the Church a lesson through this also (view thread:How christ like would you look to yourself if.....etc)



Cruz you took it that Tonex was saying "Since no one is perfect lets be imperfect". Almost in a I don't care how I'm percieved attitude. Real question no sarcasm: Do you really think he believes he shouldn't care in the context of representing Christ how he is percieved? I truly believe he does, just keep in mind as of that interview he was speaking and seeing through the heart of bitterness and bitterness has a I don't give a ..... way about it. He says he needs resoratation impying he doesn't want to stay bitter meaning he knows it wrong and therefore wrong to be acting like I don't give a right now.


I personally believe Tonex was saying "I got issues, aint no need in me fronting, yet I know I need to be and am seeking God to purge me of these issues.


One of my favorite scriptures is in St.John Chapter 15:2


Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

This scripture says we are beneficial and can be productive to the body while acknowledging the fact that we live a state indicated in Romans 7 at times. You don't have to purge nothing that is unclean. Yet God says we are in him while needing purging.

[ROB]

I know I had some things to say about Tonex on here as well and I haven't had a chance to listen to the interview yet, but I know the scripture below applies:

2 Corinthians 10:5
4For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God for the pulling down of strongholds,


5casting down imaginations and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ,

As Christians we are supposed to be fighting to cast down wrong thoughts and bring them in obedience to Christ, not blurt them out there.

Tonex has always been one of my favorites, but man it's scary when people won't adhere to scriptures and then say that people were cursing him with scriptures? Doesn't scriptures warn us about not hearing reproof?

Proverbs 12:1
Whoso loveth instruction loveth knowledge: but he that hateth reproof is brutish.

Proverbs 15:10
Correction is grievous unto him that forsaketh the way: and he that hateth reproof shall die.

As for myself, the only way for me to really change is when someone shows me a scripture (that isn't being twisted) that points out an error I may be making. It doesn't even matter to me how they say it. I may not like it at the time, but will accept it in the end because I'm hungry for truth, not my own way.

I am praying for Tonex because restoration is always the best thing when things like this happen.

[BlackCalvinist]

I can say that this is actually one of the most constructive 'controversy' threads I've ever seen on HCR.

And yes, I do recommend people listen to the interview BEFORE commenting. Not because it's necessary, but it will give you a broader perspective on how to approach the situation.

....carry on.....

[Redd Lettaz]

all i'm gonna say is we need to love the man and restore him and that goes beyond just praying ....

[DJ Wade-O]

Wow....I aint been on since I posted the link last night and I have to agree with BC, this really has been one of the better threads I have seen on HCR.

Bond Servant, to answer your question. Acknowledging the Father, Son and Holy Ghost is important to me. Prior to the interview did I tihnk it was a good question to ask Tonex? Yes. During the interview, did I think it would have added value to the interview? No. Thats why I didn't ask him. He articulated his beliefs and honestly I felt asking him about does he belief in the trinity would have started going down the path of theological discussion, which is not what I was shooting for. My Suggestion...if you really want to have that discussion with him...hit on myspace. www.myspace.com/tonexworld. He gets a ton of email so I cant promise he will reply to you, but its worth a shot.

[DJ Wade-O]

Click Here (http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=116262270&blogID=280055184&Mytoken=EE5E277D-AE16-4A28-AD742E4DA37DEE5B12245714)

Sorry I didnt post this earlier

[BlackCalvinist]

Wade, since this one's actually ending on a good note, would you mind terribly if I closed it ? I don't think much more can be added than has already been said.

I'll wait for your answer.

[C-dero]

Lord, we continue to pray for repentance from one of your hurting sons. I pray that his anger will turn into faith, love, and hope. Allow him to know that we have been called to a uneasy life, a life that continuously should have us looking forward to the consummation of your Kingdom. Father, we are kingdom kids living in a different kingdom, a kingdom that is lofty and haughty but that has no future. I pray that Tonex will recognize that all of the decrees of this world will be rendered unsuccessful and that your eternal decree, your word, will last for eternity. Expunge the anger and bitterness in his heart so that he may be saved from darkness and brought into eternal light. As sons and daughters of your Kingdom, we should expect to be thrown in the fiery furnace at times but allow it to be for righteousness sake knowing that you will be with us through the fire. Please, do not treat Tonex according to his sins, but I pray that your patience and mercy will lead him to repentance. Restore his soul Lord!

In the name of Christ Jesus!

[The_Expositor]

Can't argue w/scripture.

For a person to be restored, they must be a brother to begin with. Nothing about the song, this interview or anything else I've seen or heard from Tonex indicates that he's been born again. I'm not trying to be super-critical, but he seems like he's trying so hard to justify his sin rather than repent of it.

He continues to curse openly and blatantly throughout the entire interview. I'm sorry, but that's just not in agreement with the Spirit of God living within a believer. Peep what God said about those He would regenerate:

22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I do not [this] for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went. 23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I [am] the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes. 24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. 25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them]. Ezekiel 36:22-27

The thing is, Tonex continues to profane the name of the Lord among the heathen. We are to be representatives of God in the earth as His image bearers. If we have foul mouths, we show the world that it must be okay for us to be that way. God must not care too much if He allows us to be His children and have foul mouths and nonchalant attitudes about our sin.

Some may want to stone me, but I don't believe from what I've heard, that Tonex is a brother. Everyone's talking about restoration, but I think we'd be foolish and doing a disservice to Tonex if we didn't consider his salvation.

[jnorman888]

When looking at this issue I only had the Oneness view in mind. I wasn't even looking at the fact that he was going through hard times.

He went through a divorce and that alone can make a person depressed for months. He may of gone through some other hard times as well. So maybe reaching out to dude for the hurt and pain of life in general is needed.


As a person he needs help. I don't agree with the theology I thought he believed in and I disagree with his choice of fellowship, but as a person the man is truely in need of some help.


And he needs to be helped.





INLOVE Jnorm

Tonex is still made in God's Image so I need to love him anyway. Even when it is hard to because of what I believe to be true and right.

God still wants us to love, and I will try to do that even when I don't understand nor want to.

[ROB]

For a person to be restored, they must be a brother to begin with. Nothing about the song, this interview or anything else I've seen or heard from Tonex indicates that he's been born again. I'm not trying to be super-critical, but he seems like he's trying so hard to justify his sin rather than repent of it.

He continues to curse openly and blatantly throughout the entire interview. I'm sorry, but that's just not in agreement with the Spirit of God living within a believer. Peep what God said about those He would regenerate:

22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I do not [this] for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went. 23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I [am] the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes. 24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. 25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them]. Ezekiel 36:22-27

The thing is, Tonex continues to profane the name of the Lord among the heathen. We are to be representatives of God in the earth as His image bearers. If we have foul mouths, we show the world that it must be okay for us to be that way. God must not care too much if He allows us to be His children and have foul mouths and nonchalant attitudes about our sin.

Some may want to stone me, but I don't believe from what I've heard, that Tonex is a brother. Everyone's talking about restoration, but I think we'd be foolish and doing a disservice to Tonex if we didn't consider his salvation.

I agree with you on this. After listening to the interview, he needs salvation. Sounds like he's been just a "church person" since ProNounced TonNay.

[kingsman2ki]

For a person to be restored, they must be a brother to begin with. Nothing about the song, this interview or anything else I've seen or heard from Tonex indicates that he's been born again. I'm not trying to be super-critical, but he seems like he's trying so hard to justify his sin rather than repent of it.

He continues to curse openly and blatantly throughout the entire interview. I'm sorry, but that's just not in agreement with the Spirit of God living within a believer. Peep what God said about those He would regenerate:

22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I do not [this] for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went. 23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I [am] the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes. 24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. 25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them]. Ezekiel 36:22-27

The thing is, Tonex continues to profane the name of the Lord among the heathen. We are to be representatives of God in the earth as His image bearers. If we have foul mouths, we show the world that it must be okay for us to be that way. God must not care too much if He allows us to be His children and have foul mouths and nonchalant attitudes about our sin.

Some may want to stone me, but I don't believe from what I've heard, that Tonex is a brother. Everyone's talking about restoration, but I think we'd be foolish and doing a disservice to Tonex if we didn't consider his salvation.


Well BC, So much for ending on a good note....

Expo, your not discerning spiritually, bro. you still hung up on outwardly symptoms of the inner root of Tonex's issue.

even if you don't see him as a brother, he is still made in God's image. whether you believe he is your brother or not, that shouldn't prevent you from showing love to him, praying for him, and bearing his brudens with him...

Sometimes, instead of being the good samaritian, we act more like the Priest and the Levite!!

Look, whether or not Tonex believes in the trinity, whether or not he repented about cussing or whatever, i'm going to still look not so much at his outward actions but to his heart's cry and pray that God sends someone to him where he is to personally minister and aid Tonex thru his time of brokenness because there is more that we evidently don't know is going on with him and we can't get self-righteous and wash our hands with him.. thats not being Christ-like.


We can't spread the Gospel if we won't be the Gospel to those who need it most....

[Lynaz24]

Well BC, So much for ending on a good note....

Expo, your not discerning spiritually, bro. you still hung up on outwardly symptoms of the inner root of Tonex's issue.

even if you don't see him as a brother, he is still made in God's image. whether you believe he is your brother or not, that shouldn't prevent you from showing love to him, praying for him, and bearing his brudens with him...

Sometimes, instead of being the good samaritian, we act more like the Priest and the Levite!!

Look, whether or not Tonex believes in the trinity, whether or not he repented about cussing or whatever, i'm going to still look not so much at his outward actions but to his heart's cry and pray that God sends someone to him where he is to personally minister and aid Tonex thru his time of brokenness because there is more that we evidently don't know is going on with him and we can't get self-righteous and wash our hands with him.. thats not being Christ-like.


We can't spread the Gospel if we won't be the Gospel to those who need it most....

In the words of the great 20th century philosopher Paris Hilton....

"That's Hot":jiggy:

[The_Expositor]

Well BC, So much for ending on a good note....

Expo, your not discerning spiritually, bro. you still hung up on outwardly symptoms of the inner root of Tonex's issue.

even if you don't see him as a brother, he is still made in God's image. whether you believe he is your brother or not, that shouldn't prevent you from showing love to him, praying for him, and bearing his brudens with him...

Sometimes, instead of being the good samaritian, we act more like the Priest and the Levite!!

Look, whether or not Tonex believes in the trinity, whether or not he repented about cussing or whatever, i'm going to still look not so much at his outward actions but to his heart's cry and pray that God sends someone to him where he is to personally minister and aid Tonex thru his time of brokenness because there is more that we evidently don't know is going on with him and we can't get self-righteous and wash our hands with him.. thats not being Christ-like.


We can't spread the Gospel if we won't be the Gospel to those who need it most....

I'm not here to argue you with you bro, but I believe I am discerning spiritually, through the Word of God. I am not basing it upon "feelings" or "emotions" for another human being. You said that I am hung up with outward symptoms and not the root problem. With that, I don't think you really read my post.

I am concerned with the root problem. That root problem is sin. It's not that he was touched by a preacher when he was six years old. It's not about G Craige Lewis. It's not about anyone else but Tonex's own sin, and until he stops blaming everyone else for the sin that HE commits, what can a person do? The outward symptoms are an expression of the inner man. Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks.

It's not simply about saying you're sorry for what you've said or done. It's about truly being sorry and then STOPPING your constant sin. He said that he knows the Scripture but doesn't want to hear it when folks bring it to him. He admits that he knew the Scripture beforehand and STILL decided to do it.

It's not about being self-righteous at all. It's about showing REAL concern for another soul, who was created in the image of God. If we say that we love a blind man, yet we see him walking dangerously close to the edge of a cliff and we don't yell out to him that he's going to perish if he continues going, then we don't really love him at all.

I am praying for Tonex. I am praying for those who follow him and feel the same way as well. But most of all, I am praying that he would turn to the Lord is true repentance, which will bring forth real fruit meet with repentance, and then glorify God as He should be glorified. God is not glorified in anything he's currently doing.

[joseph29]

I'm not here to argue you with you bro, but I believe I am discerning spiritually, through the Word of God. I am not basing it upon "feelings" or "emotions" for another human being. You said that I am hung up with outward symptoms and not the root problem. With that, I don't think you really read my post.

I am concerned with the root problem. That root problem is sin. It's not that he was touched by a preacher when he was six years old. It's not about G Craige Lewis. It's not about anyone else but Tonex's own sin, and until he stops blaming everyone else for the sin that HE commits, what can a person do? The outward symptoms are an expression of the inner man. Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks.

It's not simply about saying you're sorry for what you've said or done. It's about truly being sorry and then STOPPING your constant sin. He said that he knows the Scripture but doesn't want to hear it when folks bring it to him. He admits that he knew the Scripture beforehand and STILL decided to do it.

It's not about being self-righteous at all. It's about showing REAL concern for another soul, who was created in the image of God. If we say that we love a blind man, yet we see him walking dangerously close to the edge of a cliff and we don't yell out to him that he's going to perish if he continues going, then we don't really love him at all.

praying for Tonex. I am praying for those who follow him and feel the same way as well. But most of all, I am praying that he would turn to the Lord is true repentance, which will bring forth real fruit meet with repentance, and then glorify God as He should be glorified. God is not glorified in anything he's I am currently doing.

I agree 100% with what you said, and i think most people on this board will agree with you. I dont think there's anyone on here who is agreeing with Tonex's actions. From listening to the interview to me it seems as though dude was not trying to defend his sin, but the reason he was sinning. The guy has been through so much to me it sounds like he's at his breaking point, and he wanted to release everything inside of him. But one thing I do know is that God still loves him. I can tell from the fact that all these people are concerned for him, even cats that may not necessarily be fans of his music. I cant say if dude is saved or not, judgement belongs to God.
I mean look at david, as a king he commited adultary and than had her husband killed in battle. I'm sure if his story ended right there many of us would question if david was truly a man after God's own heart. But God gave him a chance to repent and earn forgiveness from him. So i say lets pray that God gives Tonex a chance to earn repentance, and renew his relationship with God.

[Kerry1914]

Actually Kingsman, it's still on a good note.

Re-read what Expo is saying. The Bible approaches issues of behavior not as a matter of 'some hurt we've experienced' (which is psychology and unbiblical), but as a matter of what originates from within us that defiles us (Matthew 15:15-20). Pain, hurt, etc... are no excuse for his behavior. Period. That's scripture. 1 John 3:1-10 and Galatians 5 don't have exception clauses for 'having a bad day'.

What is needed is biblical repentance. Godly sorrow leads to repentance (David ala Psalm 51) and salvation. Worldly sorrow (Judas) makes one feel sorry for their sin or the results of their sin, but doesn't take care of turning them away from doing it or other sin again.

So while Tonex might be feeling a bit of worldly sorrow over the reaction saints have given him for his language, he's not feeling godly sorrow - at least he wasn't as of the interview with Wade because he kept cursing like it was no thing.

So you can spend time focused on his pain all you'd like. But the issue at hand - the FIRST issue at hand - is how he reacts to it. Job lost a lot more than he did, but the scriptures tell us that Job did NOT sin with his lips during that whole time (Job 1-2). Instead, he reacted to the tradgedy in his life with praise and worship to God. Even when his wife told him to curse God and die, he, with sores covering his body, did not.

So Expo has actually brought some additional BIBLICAL wisdom to this discussion that I think you haven't really taken into consideration.

My observation.

Grace.

[4Sight Sounds]

It's not about being self-righteous at all. It's about showing REAL concern for another soul, who was created in the image of God. If we say that we love a blind man, yet we see him walking dangerously close to the edge of a cliff and we don't yell out to him that he's going to perish if he continues going, then we don't really love him at all.

I am praying for Tonex. I am praying for those who follow him and feel the same way as well. But most of all, I am praying that he would turn to the Lord is true repentance, which will bring forth real fruit meet with repentance, and then glorify God as He should be glorified. God is not glorified in anything he's currently doing.

....I was starting to think I was losing my mind, 'til I read this.

[BondServant]

Look, whether or not Tonex believes in the trinity... i'm going to still look not so much at his outward actions but to his heart's cry and pray that God sends someone to him where he is to personally minister and aid Tonex thru his time of brokenness because there is more that we evidently don't know is going on with him and we can't get self-righteous and wash our hands with him.. thats not being Christ-like.


Whether or not he believes in the Trinity?!?!?!?

I'm gonna start fellowshipping with satanists then.


*walks out of thread mumbling to himself*

[ROB]

Well BC, So much for ending on a good note....

Expo, your not discerning spiritually, bro. you still hung up on outwardly symptoms of the inner root of Tonex's issue.

even if you don't see him as a brother, he is still made in God's image. whether you believe he is your brother or not, that shouldn't prevent you from showing love to him, praying for him, and bearing his brudens with him...

Sometimes, instead of being the good samaritian, we act more like the Priest and the Levite!!

Look, whether or not Tonex believes in the trinity, whether or not he repented about cussing or whatever, i'm going to still look not so much at his outward actions but to his heart's cry and pray that God sends someone to him where he is to personally minister and aid Tonex thru his time of brokenness because there is more that we evidently don't know is going on with him and we can't get self-righteous and wash our hands with him.. thats not being Christ-like.


We can't spread the Gospel if we won't be the Gospel to those who need it most....

How is washing our hands of someone not being Christ-like?

Bro, I'm gonna have to agree with Ex on this one. Ex is not being self righteous according to the Bible. The mentality you have towards this situation is considered "puffed up" or "proud" according to the Word. I pray that many that share your point of view stop being manipulated through their emotions and start allowing the Word to dictate to you the stance to take in certain situaitons.

Here's scripture:

1 Corinthians 5:1-2
1It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.

2And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.


Now I know many try to ignore verse 2, but Paul was calling the church proud because they didn't mourn because of what this person did and wanted the person removed from the church. Of course the goal is repentance, AND NOT HIS DEMISE, but in many cases true repentance won't happen without some form of discipline going forth first.

Do you want to see what else your mentality is leading you to be guilty of?

Proverbs 17:15
He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the LORD.

You are sitting there typing that it doesn't matter that Tonex didn't sincerely repent of his actions? That means you are justifying his wickedness and that mentality is an abomination to God! You say you are looking at his heart, well Jesus said out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. What's been coming of his mouth? Cursing, bitterness and pain!! Why? Because he hasn't been real with God in private. He hadn't truly given his heart to Jesus.

Tonex is not only a singer, he is also a pastor A LEADER IN THE BODY! You are completely ignoring the tremendous influence this guy has on hundreds of thousands of people and how he doesn't even seem to care. He didn't seem one bit interested in shouldering the responsibility he has of leading those he has influenced. Rather than being like Paul and saying, "follow me as I follow Christ", he pulled a Stacie Orrico "Don't look at me, look at Him".

You can't handle a leader in the church the same as someone who isn't. And if an unbeliever gets to be a leader in the church, that should be an embarrasment to the church!

So now I pose the question to you that Paul posed to the church in Corinth.

Are you proud and not rather mourned that the man who has done these things should be taken away from us?

Selah.

[DJ Wade-O]

BC...my opinion keep it open bro. You close threads when they get bad. You shouldn't close them when they get good. Even with what Expo, Rob and others have added, its good convo. As believers, even when we don't agree, we should look at all sides of teh situation, becsause we just might learn something.

This will not be the last time that any of us encounter a situation like this. It may not be as public as Tonex, but still. I do hope this is able to be a learning experience for all of us.

[Kerry1914]

Look, whether or not Tonex believes in the trinity,


WHOAH SON! I ain't see this before.

If he doesn't believe in the Trinity, he's not a Christian.

Period.

There is no other God in the Bible but the Triune God (Isaiah 48:12-16). Believe in any other concept of God, you believe in an IDOL.

Further, there is no GOSPEL without the Trinity.

[BondServant]

Further, there is no GOSPEL without the Trinity.

Nope, no salvation without it.

Eph. 1:3-14

[jnorman888]

Nope, no salvation without it.

Eph. 1:3-14


True, but you can still love him as a person. The dude is in need of help, so hate the sin but love the sinner.







Inlove jnorm

You don't have to call him a christian in order to feel for him.

[BondServant]

True, but you can still love him as a person. The dude is in need of help, so hate the sin but love the sinner.

Inlove jnorm

You don't have to call him a christian in order to feel for him.

John,

I didn't say anything about not showing love. Or feeling for him.

Psalm 5:5

[Kerry1914]

In fact, the most LOVING thing you can do for him is to tell him he's walking on a spiritual landmine.......

Folk forget - you can 'love' someone all you want, but if you don't give them the truth, they won't be saved. You can 'love' the gay person in your life as unconditionally as you want, but if you only speak of Christ in 'positive' terms around them and never tell them that their SIN is what will take them to hell and that they must repent and believe - how LOVING are you REALLY ?

You loved them so much you let them go to hell rather than offend them with truth.

Psshhh.

Hate.
Me.

[The_Expositor]

I can't remember the author of this quote but it goes like this:

"I'd rather you hate me for telling you the truth than to love me for telling you lies."

[DJ Links]

Ahh this is more like HCR. Let's label Tonex as one outside of the faith and not saved.

Let's see; LaRosa spoke to Applejaxx (which is very recent) who is in Tonex's camp and he confirmed that he believed in the Trinity (I know Bond that your question is eating at you). At this point we don't have any proof that he doesn't (For those that say his music proves it then I ask how old are the cd's). In the interview he said Jesus was his saviour. Did he sound unrepentant in the interview? Sure did. Dude is still hurting and it's gonna take time for healing to take place.

Question for the fam is this.......

Compared to the talking we are doing on HCR about Tonex, is it in the same porportion to your praying for him?

[BondServant]

Ahh this is more like HCR. Let's label Tonex as one outside of the faith and not saved.

Let's see; LaRosa spoke to Applejaxx (which is very recent) who is in Tonex's camp and he confirmed that he believed in the Trinity (I know Bond that your question is eating at you). At this point we don't have any proof that he doesn't (For those that say his music proves it then I ask how old are the cd's). In the interview he said Jesus as his saviour. Did he sound unrepentant in the interview? Sure did. Dude is still hurting and it's gonna take time for healing to take place.

Your absolutely right, it is eating at me. But even still, how would you look at me preaching and teaching and fellowshipping at a Mormon, JW, church?


Question for the fam is this.......

Compared to the talking we are doing on HCR about Tonex, is it in the same porportion to your praying for him?

And if it is, then what?

[jnorman888]

Ahh this is more like HCR. Let's label Tonex as one outside of the faith and not saved.

Let's see; LaRosa spoke to Applejaxx (which is very recent) who is in Tonex's camp and he confirmed that he believed in the Trinity (I know Bond that your question is eating at you). At this point we don't have any proof that he doesn't (For those that say his music proves it then I ask how old are the cd's). In the interview he said Jesus was his saviour. Did he sound unrepentant in the interview? Sure did. Dude is still hurting and it's gonna take time for healing to take place.

Question for the fam is this.......

Compared to the talking we are doing on HCR about Tonex, is it in the same porportion to your praying for him?


If what you said about Applejax and Tonex is true then I need to repent for my past comments.

[DJ Links]

Your absolutely right, it is eating at me. But even still, how would you look at me preaching and teaching and fellowshipping at a Mormon, JW, church?

No gripe with you there. I think a part of your answer is in the beginning of the interview where Tonex talks about being feeling obligated to pastor his fathers church. What a lot of people don't know is the same week that his father passed he was getting ready to move to the ATL and become a part of a ministry here.




And if it is, then what?

Then I question how one can continue to talk ABOUT someone and still pray for them. Just a question I have.

[DJ Links]

If what you said about Applejax and Tonex is true then I need to repent for my past comments.

I am not saying anything that has not been said on the boards. Do a search on Larosa's comments.

[The_Expositor]

Ahh this is more like HCR. Let's label Tonex as one outside of the faith and not saved.

Let's see; LaRosa spoke to Applejaxx (which is very recent) who is in Tonex's camp and he confirmed that he believed in the Trinity (I know Bond that your question is eating at you). At this point we don't have any proof that he doesn't (For those that say his music proves it then I ask how old are the cd's). In the interview he said Jesus was his saviour. Did he sound unrepentant in the interview? Sure did. Dude is still hurting and it's gonna take time for healing to take place.

Question for the fam is this.......

Compared to the talking we are doing on HCR about Tonex, is it in the same porportion to your praying for him?

What would have Paul done with Tonex, or any of us who was unrepentant? What would Paul have said about those of us who refuse to hold Tonex accountable? Read 1 Cor. 5

[DJ Links]

What would have Paul done with Tonex, or any of us who was unrepentant? What would Paul have said about those of us who refuse to hold Tonex accountable? Read 1 Cor. 5

Won't argue with the scripts. Are we still going to talk ABOUT him? How about pray for him?

[BondServant]

Deuteronomy 6:14
You shall not go after other gods, the gods of the peoples who are around you,

Deuteronomy 8:19
And if you forget the LORD your God and go after other gods and serve them and worship them, I solemnly warn you today that you shall surely perish.

Deuteronomy 11:28
and the curse, if you do not obey the commandments of the LORD your God, but turn aside from the way that I am commanding you today, to go after other gods that you have not known.

Deuteronomy 13:2
and the sign or wonder that he tells you comes to pass, and if he says, 'Let us go after other gods,' which you have not known, 'and let us serve them,'

Deuteronomy 28:14
and if you do not turn aside from any of the words that I command you today, to the right hand or to the left, to go after other gods to serve them.

Judges 2:12
And they abandoned the LORD, the God of their fathers, who had brought them out of the land of Egypt. They went after other gods, from among the gods of the peoples who were around them, and bowed down to them. And they provoked the LORD to anger.

Judges 2:17
Yet they did not listen to their judges, for they whored after other gods and bowed down to them. They soon turned aside from the way in which their fathers had walked, who had obeyed the commandments of the LORD, and they did not do so.

Judges 2:19
But whenever the judge died, they turned back and were more corrupt than their fathers, going after other gods, serving them and bowing down to them. They did not drop any of their practices or their stubborn ways.

1 Kings 11:4
For when Solomon was old his wives turned away his heart after other gods, and his heart was not wholly true to the LORD his God, as was the heart of David his father.

1 Kings 11:10
and had commanded him concerning this thing, that he should not go after other gods. But he did not keep what the LORD commanded.

Jeremiah 7:6
if you do not oppress the sojourner, the fatherless, or the widow, or shed innocent blood in this place, and if you do not go after other gods to your own harm,

Jeremiah 7:9
Will you steal, murder, commit adultery, swear falsely, make offerings to Baal, and go after other gods that you have not known,

Jeremiah 11:10
They have turned back to the iniquities of their forefathers, who refused to hear my words. They have gone after other gods to serve them. The house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant that I made with their fathers.

Jeremiah 13:10
This evil people, who refuse to hear my words, who stubbornly follow their own heart and have gone after other gods to serve them and worship them, shall be like this loincloth, which is good for nothing.

Jeremiah 16:11
then you shall say to them: 'Because your fathers have forsaken me, declares the LORD, and have gone after other gods and have served and worshiped them, and have forsaken me and have not kept my law,

Jeremiah 25:6
Do not go after other gods to serve and worship them, or provoke me to anger with the work of your hands. Then I will do you no harm.'

Jeremiah 35:15
I have sent to you all my servants the prophets, sending them persistently, saying, 'Turn now every one of you from his evil way, and amend your deeds, and do not go after other gods to serve them, and then you shall dwell in the land that I gave to you and your fathers.' But you did not incline your ear or listen to me.


So, if I'm a Trinitarian, and I'm out there fellowshipping and worshiping the same god as Oneness, Mormons, and JW's, then there's a problem. The people in these passages knew of the Covenant Lord, but went out and served other gods. There is no other god. So if Israel was out fellowshipping and worshipping with the pagan nations, then God pronounced Judgement on them, and the church of the OT were to stone those who sought other gods. What do you think our job is? It ain't to be cool with these cats and tell them it's cool to fellowship with idolaters. It ain't cool to me anyway.

[DJ Links]

So, if I'm a Trinitarian, and I'm out there fellowshipping and worshiping the same god as Oneness, Mormons, and JW's, then there's a problem. The people in these passages knew of the Covenant Lord, but went out and served other gods. There is no other god. So if Israel was out fellowshipping and worshipping with the pagan nations, then God pronounced Judgement on them, and the church of the OT were to stone those who sought other gods. What do you think our job is? It ain't to be cool with these cats and tell them it's cool to fellowship with idolaters. It ain't cool to me anyway.

Did you read my post?

[Cowboy]

So, if I'm a Trinitarian, and I'm out there fellowshipping and worshiping the same god as Oneness, Mormons, and JW's, then there's a problem. The people in these passages knew of the Covenant Lord, but went out and served other gods. There is no other god. So if Israel was out fellowshipping and worshipping with the pagan nations, then God pronounced Judgement on them, and the church of the OT were to stone those who sought other gods. What do you think our job is? It ain't to be cool with these cats and tell them it's cool to fellowship with idolaters. It ain't cool to me anyway.

Passage 2 Kings 5:18:
18 But may the LORD forgive your servant for this one thing: When my master enters the temple of Rimmon to bow down and he is leaning on my arm and I bow there also—when I bow down in the temple of Rimmon, may the LORD forgive your servant for this."


What about this situation? Just throwing that out there. Actually read this in my one year Bible here recently. Found it quite interesting.

[BondServant]

Did you read my post?

yep, and I acknowledged it. What about my post makes you think I didn't?

[DJ Links]

yep, and I acknowledged it. What about my post makes you think I didn't?

I thought you might have thought I didn't agree with you after posting one of the Canons.

[BondServant]

Passage 2 Kings 5:18:
18 But may the LORD forgive your servant for this one thing: When my master enters the temple of Rimmon to bow down and he is leaning on my arm and I bow there also—when I bow down in the temple of Rimmon, may the LORD forgive your servant for this."


What about this situation? Just throwing that out there. Actually read this in my one year Bible here recently. Found it quite interesting.

I'm aware of the situation. So do we just abandon the scripts that I posted. Is Tonex, or anyone like him in this same situation. Is this something that we should do? Is this what Tonex, or anyone else is doing?

[The_Expositor]

No gripe with you there. I think a part of your answer is in the beginning of the interview where Tonex talks about being feeling obligated to pastor his fathers church. What a lot of people don't know is the same week that his father passed he was getting ready to move to the ATL and become a part of a ministry here.





Then I question how one can continue to talk ABOUT someone and still pray for them. Just a question I have.

I wasn't feeling his take on becoming pastor. I don't think he was called to the pastorate. His taking over was to make sure his father's legacy didn't die? That's not a good reason to take on such a position and role as pastor.

[Kerry1914]

*sings*

Feeeeeeelings....

WHOAH....WHOAH...WHOAH....
FEEEEEEELings.......

[The_Expositor]

how bout we do an interview with expositor, bondservant, me and tonex?

that would be dope.

[t-roberts]

Not to change the subject, but was Tonex talking about G. Craig Lewis:unsure:. When Tonex said rumors were said about him.

[Cowboy]

I'm aware of the situation. So do we just abandon the scripts that I posted. Is Tonex, or anyone like him in this same situation. Is this something that we should do? Is this what Tonex, or anyone else is doing?

No, I don't think we need to abandon anything you wrote. I'm not even saying I disagree with you. I'm just asking how do we take this text in light of everything going on? This situation seems quite relevant to what happened with Tonex, from what I can gather. Doesn't make anything more right or more wrong, I'm just saying, we have to take the whole of scripture when addressing issues. This one seems to be saying something.

[Cyple]

I don't know what to say about that interview except that I feel for the brotha, because he went through a lot. Is cussing on a song show that someone is not saved? I wouldn't go as far and say that. I would say it was not wise to make that song. Would I classify him as not saved because he did it? Based on just that I couldn't.

My boy told me a story of his one of his cousins mistreating his great grandmother and the reaction of his family was to take the dude out. This brotha's family is one of the biggest ministering families in the community. Would I say that they weren't saved for reacting the way that they did? No. Was it wise to do that? No. What Tonex did wasn't even close to what they planned to do. I think that God allows us to stumble mightily and still be partakers of salvation.

I hope and pray that Tonex sees the error of his ways and repents and sees that sort of reaction is not cool. The real show of our Christian walk is that we learn from our mistakes and don't continue in them. I think that many Christians are afraid to make mistakes, so we isolate ourselves from any possibility of making a mistake. I'm not saying go out and put yourself in situations that you know you can't handle. If we have the Holy Spirit we should trust that he will guide us and help us in the time of trouble. We have the armor of God for a reason and that is to USE it! Some of our armor has never been used! It's like playing football and you don't got no scuff marks on your jersey. The only way that you will not sin anymore is to die.

[EBro]

Its sad to see alot us in here with our dancing shoes on twinkle-toeing around the issue. Tonex, you are a gifted artist and as a Brother in Christ, I love you. I am praying for you. Now its your turn to do something. People are debating on this board about your actions, and it really doesn't matter because God will not forgive you based on the conversation here. He's going to forgive you when you humble yourself and repent to Him. Of Course you already know that, or do you? In order to have restoration, you must first be willing to be restored. I heard the interview and was troubled by your abrasive behavior. Tonex, that is not a humble spirit that you displayed with DJ Wade. Stop suppressing the Holy Spirit and allow God to move in your life in response to scriptures. You feel like people are cussing at you with scriptures because you don't want the light shed on you. But if its the Word of God, no matter how people use it, the Spirit will respond appropriately. It may hurt, but its hurting your pride and feeding your soul. I have listened to your music since "Pronounced Toe-Nay" hit the shelves in '97. If you have been like this since then, then imagine how God can use you. I feel for your struggles and pain as I have experienced losses and hurts, but you do not have the right to represent God and act any way you feel. I pray you take this in love. I like to keep it real and not dance around the issue. God has given you a gift that some on this board covet. But, God has given you a responsibility in your music, His music. If you are not called to pastor a church, then stop what you are doing and allow that congregation to find someone that is. 1 Timothy 3:1-13 lays out the foundation. God requires nothing less than what is outlined here. If you see people out of compliance with this, you cannot point and say this is why I do what I do. Your responsibility is to God. Bro, I am praying for you and hope this message finds you. I don't coddle, I don't condemn, I love people and especially the people of God. This is why I write this wayand hopefully the rest of us can stop dancing on message boards and dance for God in praise.


Love,
Ed

[CJ led]

In Naked Truth we all know he's explaining that he got hurt from the Church World the Gospel Music Industry and the main man who hates holy hip hop today. Not justifying the words he used. But we all know that the Church World and the Gospel Industry are beasts. I believe us as the Holy Hip Hop community need to keep tonex in our prayers give him some encouragement that he will get over his anger towards the communities I have just mentioned above. Because we got to remember that we as Holy Hip Hop heads arent the most received bunch in the Church either. Cuz the Lord knows I still get dirty looks and I spent my teenage years in there.

In the End its all about Jesus Christ and his Glory not about us!!