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jeyjey34
01-07-2014, 11:13 PM
Looks like Lecrae's influence has rubbed off on Andy Mineo. He'd like to work with Kanye. Exerpt:
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"I'd love to get in a room with Kanye [West] (http://www.mtv.com/artists/kanye-west/) at some point, have a conversation, and see if something cooks up," Andy told MTV News on Tuesday (January 7). "Obviously he's a legend already. His track record is amazing and I think he's in a unique place in his faith journey withYeezus...
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"I think with my presence in hip-hop, if we were able to mix it up would lead to some good conversation, probably some good music too," Mineo said. "A lot of these dudes grew up in churches, a lot of these dudes have some kind of history, but they refuse to talk about it and that might create some space for us to talk about it on record. I think that would be really cool to see happen in hip-hop."

http://images2.mtv.com/uri/mgid:uma:content:mtv.com:1720042?width=281&height=211

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1720042/andy-mineo-wants-kanye-west-collaboration.jhtml (http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1720042/andy-mineo-wants-kanye-west-collaboration.jhtml)

Trademark
01-08-2014, 12:58 AM
SMH, I'm all for showing love and spreading the light of CHRIST. But when are we going to draw a line? Kanye's album is a mockery to my LORD and SAVIOUR with the title it has and Kanye has done some blasphemous things along with Jay-Z..........SMH

mstrom
01-08-2014, 01:20 AM
I hope they make a mixtape together :) :)

slamdunk
01-08-2014, 01:11 PM
Talk about Jesus, be nice to folks sounds like a good method. I have done blasphemous things, peter did blasphemous things. Jesus is the friend of sinners, if he wasn't we wouldn't be posting on this board.

plainoleme
01-08-2014, 03:58 PM
Sin in essence is an affront to God generally speaking...

JustinR
01-08-2014, 08:46 PM
Andy was literally in the interview for about 30 minutes. They kept this section of the interview and ran with his comment and made the headline catchy. Andy was actually least confident about that answer and they happen to use it in the article. Like most media, very edited. But overall, there's nothing still wrong with this article nor is seeking a conversation evil or wrong.

jeyjey34
01-09-2014, 01:00 AM
But overall, there's nothing still wrong with this article nor is seeking a conversation evil or wrong.
Seeking conversation isn't the problem. If this article was just about seeking conservation, I wouldn't have bothered to post it.

seal
01-09-2014, 02:01 AM
Yo,

Reach Records are showing themselves to be real grade A COWARDS and this type of reckless has officially made me take the gloves off. I will be confronting these dudes pastors once again and KB lives here in Tampa so he's first on my list.

Kanye is not in the Faith. There is only one Faith. This dude Andy was acting like a straight up groupie to Kanye's talent and art instead of at least being clear about what True Faith is. Who cares if people grew up in Church..... SATAN IS AN ANGEL.... Again this Gospel Bankrupted methodology that Anthony Bradley has spread to REACH and other groups is spreading like Cancer.

Like I said on my Facebook page.... "Us Christians today in America are the most Scary and Sugar-Coated Christian than in any Age of the Church."

Grace and Peace,
seal

JustinR
01-09-2014, 04:44 PM
Yo,

Reach Records are showing themselves to be real grade A COWARDS and this type of reckless has officially made me take the gloves off. I will be confronting these dudes pastors once again and KB lives here in Tampa so he's first on my list.

Kanye is not in the Faith. There is only one Faith. This dude Andy was acting like a straight up groupie to Kanye's talent and art instead of at least being clear about what True Faith is. Who cares if people grew up in Church..... SATAN IS AN ANGEL.... Again this Gospel Bankrupted methodology that Anthony Bradley has spread to REACH and other groups is spreading like Cancer.

Like I said on my Facebook page.... "Us Christians today in America are the most Scary and Sugar-Coated Christian than in any Age of the Church."

Grace and Peace,
seal

Honestly bro I'll have to respectfully disagree with you and your claims and calling them cowards when really you don't know them. Andy and I have the same pastor and if you'd like to have a respectful conversation I can arrange that. Our church website is http://www.christcrucifiednyc.org feel free to check our website. Also feel free not to shoot allegations about people you do not personally know. And before you say this, if you happen to think " you'll know them by their fruits" Please don't go there lol.

jeyjey34
01-09-2014, 05:06 PM
Andy and I have the same pastor and if you'd like to have a respectful conversation I can arrange that. Our church website is http://www.christcrucifiednyc.org feel free to check our website.
So your church likes it when christians collaborate musically with artists who are known for making a mockery of Jesus and christianity?

K-Train
01-09-2014, 05:41 PM
Last time I checked, People are People.

Guess we have to knock out Lecrae and S1 since they work with people in the secular industry.

IMO, We need laborers and people within the industry that can be a light to the people in the secular industry. How else are they going to receive the Gospel? Lets also add to the fact that we have no idea what goes on behind closed doors, so we should not be so quick to jump to ASSUMPTIONS about a persons character or how the Media outlets like to paint and portray people that we only get to see minutes of at a time.

K-Train
01-09-2014, 05:44 PM
SMH, I'm all for showing love and spreading the light of CHRIST. But when are we going to draw a line? Kanye's album is a mockery to my LORD and SAVIOUR with the title it has and Kanye has done some blasphemous things along with Jay-Z..........SMH

So what do you suggest we do about it?

The Light Within
01-09-2014, 07:31 PM
Many people have been saved because of the prayers and service of Christians, so we shouldn't turn our backs on unbelievers, but having any kind of intimate relationship with an unbeliever can quickly and easily turn into something that is a hindrance to our walk with Christ. We are called to evangelize the lost, not be intimate with them. There is nothing wrong with building quality friendships with unbelievers, but the primary focus of such a relationship should be to win them to Christ by sharing the Gospel with them and demonstrating God’s saving power in our own lives.

seal
01-09-2014, 07:34 PM
Honestly bro I'll have to respectfully disagree with you and your claims and calling them cowards when really you don't know them. Andy and I have the same pastor and if you'd like to have a respectful conversation I can arrange that. Our church website is http://www.christcrucifiednyc.org feel free to check our website. Also feel free not to shoot allegations about people you do not personally know. And before you say this, if you happen to think " you'll know them by their fruits" Please don't go there lol.


Well if your Pastor is ok with this dude representing his teaching and discipleship then perhaps he needs some chiding as well. It doesn't have to be from me though. My Pastor would be more than happy to discuss these matters further. From what I know Andy and your Pastor are buddies and have been for a while which is why accountability is lacking.

Yet, don't get me wrong. I am not here to disrespect these dudes. It's nothing personal. I am here to call these dudes out as deceivers and manipulators of the Truth. Kanye is not in the Faith and it's an insult to Christendom to Sugar-Coat that. God is Holy Homie. Him wanting to do a Co-lab with Kanye is girly. I have never seen so many Christians in my life who were so just so geek about Satan's Kids approval and abilities. I mean this may be a first time in Christendom where this is happening as a norm to these dudes with platforms. And this is what you do with Christ on your platform??? SMH.... Lord Help Us....

So it is clear to me that Reach has reached a state of Delusion and their fans are trapped in the Delusion. Here is my conclusion:

REACH is OUT

Grace and Peace,
seal

The Light Within
01-09-2014, 07:44 PM
So it is clear to me that Reach has reached a state of Delusion and their fans are trapped in the Delusion. Here is my conclusion:

REACH is OUT

I never found Andy's music to be very uplifiting or edifying, so I've never purchased any of his music. Something is off, but I can't quite put my finger on it yet.

AudienceOfOne
01-09-2014, 07:55 PM
Well if your Pastor is ok with this dude representing his teaching and discipleship then perhaps he needs some chiding as well. It doesn't have to be from me though. My Pastor would be more than happy to discuss these matters further. From what I know Andy and your Pastor are buddies and have been for a while which is why accountability is lacking.

Yet, don't get me wrong. I am not here to disrespect these dudes. It's nothing personal. I am here to call these dudes out as deceivers and manipulators of the Truth. Kanye is not in the Faith and it's an insult to Christendom to Sugar-Coat that. God is Holy Homie. Him wanting to do a Co-lab with Kanye is girly. I have never seen so many Christians in my life who were so just so geek about Satan's Kids approval and abilities. I mean this may be a first time in Christendom where this is happening as a norm to these dudes with platforms. And this is what you do with Christ on your platform??? SMH.... Lord Help Us....

So it is clear to me that Reach has reached a state of Delusion and their fans are trapped in the Delusion. Here is my conclusion:

REACH is OUT

Grace and Peace,
seal
Wow. I love how this has been a (more or less) good conversation about christian rap and Christianity's relationship to the culture in general, but you just assume any good pastor would rebuke him and that they are blatant "deceivers and manipulators of the Truth." I would argue but you and some others on this board don't seem like the type of people that are capable of seeing something through a different perspective or having a civil in-house discussion about something we disagree about. There are good, well-argued defenses of the missiology and view of the culture that these guys work with by Orthodox (even reformed) Christians like Bradley, Schaeffer, Kuyper, etc. that you need to listen to and respect. If you disagree that's fine but making ignorant statements like I see from multiple people here will get us no where.

seal
01-09-2014, 08:21 PM
Wow. I love how this has been a (more or less) good conversation about christian rap and Christianity's relationship to the culture in general, but you just assume any good pastor would rebuke him and that they are blatant "deceivers and manipulators of the Truth." I would argue but you and some others on this board don't seem like the type of people that are capable of seeing something through a different perspective or having a civil in-house discussion about something we disagree about. There are good, well-argued defenses of the missiology and view of the culture that these guys work with by Orthodox (even reformed) Christians like Bradley, Schaeffer, Kuyper, etc. that you need to listen to and respect. If you disagree that's fine but making ignorant statements like I see from multiple people here will get us no where.

Well, I have been against Schaeffer, Kuyper, and I just made a song on Bradley...LOL.... Found here:

https://soundcloud.com/seal_da_zeal/genesis-1-and-2-response


They are not Orthodox nor are they reformed. More like Deformed. They have definitely miss-the-ology alright.

The bait and switch evangelism is blatantly deceptive and manipulative. It's not Biblical and is a Humanistic concoction of man. You can't dupe anyone into the Faith and the LORD doesn't need our gimmicks. This is why the Fruit stinks. It's man-made.

And there are plenty of good pastors who have rebuked them..... Voddie and Conway.... to name two. I know my Pastor thinks it bankrupts the Gospel. And I've talked to K. Scott Oliphant who is the chair of apologetics at Westminister in Philly who gave Dr. Anthony Bradley (who is in hiding) his PHD said that this position is BUNK and Heretical. So yes..... I have been having this conversation with many reputable people. And I've given the open invite for Dr. Bradley to stop hiding behind his weak twitter account and to step to the plate and discuss these matters.

So I'm civil but passionate about this topic because it has single handedly ruined our Genre if you can't see.

Grace and Peace,
seal

benjamin
01-09-2014, 08:56 PM
Well, I have been against Schaeffer, Kuyper, and I just made a song on Bradley...LOL.... Found here:

https://soundcloud.com/seal_da_zeal/genesis-1-and-2-response


They are not Orthodox nor are they reformed. More like Deformed. They have definitely miss-the-ology alright.

The bait and switch evangelism is blatantly deceptive and manipulative. It's not Biblical and is a Humanistic concoction of man. You can't dupe anyone into the Faith and the LORD doesn't need our gimmicks. This is why the Fruit stinks. It's man-made.

And there are plenty of good pastors who have rebuked them..... Voddie and Conway.... to name two. I know my Pastor thinks it bankrupts the Gospel. And I've talked to K. Scott Oliphant who is the chair of apologetics at Westminister in Philly who gave Dr. Anthony Bradley (who is in hiding) his PHD said that this position is BUNK and Heretical. So yes..... I have been having this conversation with many reputable people. And I've given the open invite for Dr. Bradley to stop hiding behind his weak twitter account and to step to the plate and discuss these matters.

So I'm civil but passionate about this topic because it has single handedly ruined our Genre if you can't see.

Grace and Peace,
seal

You not feeling Kuyper or Schaeffer?

The fact that God has enemies seems to be getting lost. And also that God made it that way. He was the one who drew the dividing lines in Gen 3 between the seed of the serpent and the seed of the woman. He is not shy about having enemies. He makes peace with those who hear and repent but with those who stridently oppose Him, He will repay them to their faces.

And while we are all enemies there are those who are self-consciously and openly opposed to God while some merely seek their own pleasure and ends until the Lord opens their eyes. Kanye has repeatedly exalted himself like so many others before that God has opposed. I'm not opposed to someone having a conversation with him but it should be more like the conversation David had with Goliath: we fear the living God who will strike you blasphemer down unless you repent and turn to him. Not hey, let's make music together and see if you change your mind.

JustinR
01-09-2014, 08:56 PM
Well if your Pastor is ok with this dude representing his teaching and discipleship then perhaps he needs some chiding as well. It doesn't have to be from me though. My Pastor would be more than happy to discuss these matters further. From what I know Andy and your Pastor are buddies and have been for a while which is why accountability is lacking.

Alright so I'll start here. You obviously don't know Andy nor do you know Rich.(and that's not your fault) So let's start there. They go back to the T.R.U.C.E.(An urban music/drama/evangelist group that would do music and preach the gospel on city streets wherever they went. (T)o. (R)each. (U)rban. (C)ommunities. (E)verywhere. - Maybe you already knew this) days together, because they happened to meet back then. I met Rich and he had a burden to plant a church community where I now live of Washington Heights/Inwood area of NYC, a predominately Dominican neighborhood.

After much work and toil, myself and some others were part of the church plant which is now called Christ Crucified Fellowship which was originally planted through Acts 29 (Mark Driscoll's Church planting network which many of you despise). And we are being funded by a baptist church down in Pensacola, Florida called 'Olive Baptist Church' because we are only a few years old. We are building our Eldership, Deacons, leaders, Pastors, accountability with resources, finances, etc. because we are new and still growing. We began in my apartment then we moved to a boxing gym by God's grace where we can meet every sunday.

Andy was an active leader and community group leader in our small group within my house for a little while before his tours started kicking up. Through prayer and counsel, Rich (his friend, and obviously bad accountability partner) felt it was from the Lord to sit him down from being an active leader and community group leader because of the fact he would not be around a whole lot and we value community and devotion. Although they are friends, they are co-laborers, which I believe is biblical, and we are under authority, including Andy and Rich.


Yet, don't get me wrong. I am not here to disrespect these dudes. It's nothing personal. I am here to call these dudes out as deceivers and manipulators of the Truth. Kanye is not in the Faith and it's an insult to Christendom to Sugar-Coat that. God is Holy Homie. Him wanting to do a Co-lab with Kanye is girly. I have never seen so many Christians in my life who were so just so geek about Satan's Kids approval and abilities. I mean this may be a first time in Christendom where this is happening as a norm to these dudes with platforms. And this is what you do with Christ on your platform??? SMH.... Lord Help Us....
No offense to this statement, but I feel you did disrespect not only myself (because they are close personal friends and leaders of mine) but also them, what they stand for, do, and believe, and you don't know them - at all. For me it is personal, because emotions are real, and I live with these dudes, I live out community with them, I pray with them, argue with them, sharpen them and become sharpened and rebuked by them.

Kanye may not be of the faith, and I sat down with Andy on my couch and he was speaking to me about the entire interview which was 30 minutes long. He is a creative dude, with solid theology. Not perfect, because obviously none of us are, but a genuine dude, but you don't have to take my word for it because honestly, you don't know me either :). I visit these forums often and I don't say much any more, I mostly observe, and in my observations I can see sometimes my words wont register with anyone and they'll fall to the ground. However, on this particular place and time, I feel it is necessary to address you in love and honesty.

I know you to be very zealous, outspoken, and for the truth, and I respect and admire that. You are very articulate and passionate about truth and God's holiness and mission. However, in my estimation, you are wrong for your words here. We're all going to be held accountable, which I'm certain you know.

You are correct, Kanye is unholy, and he is a blasphemer and he mocks God. Andy is a Christian who holds to the faith and the truth and the fact he wants to have a conversation is fine, and he'll probably never get to, who knows? I see your point about making music with him, which Andy told me he was sort of off guard with the question and looked at that answer as a more creative process, take it how you'd like.


So it is clear to me that Reach has reached a state of Delusion and their fans are trapped in the Delusion. Here is my conclusion:

REACH is OUT

You are entitled to your conviction and belief system about Reach, which I have nothing to say about Reach because I'm not with them. I'm with Andy and Rich, whom you mentioned in this message, which I am addressing. For my church family including Andy, he has not reached a state of delusion.


Grace and Peace

I much appreciate grace and I am for peace. I hope you are too.

seal
01-09-2014, 10:22 PM
You not feeling Kuyper or Schaeffer?

The fact that God has enemies seems to be getting lost. And also that God made it that way. He was the one who drew the dividing lines in Gen 3 between the seed of the serpent and the seed of the woman. He is not shy about having enemies. He makes peace with those who hear and repent but with those who stridently oppose Him, He will repay them to their faces.

And while we are all enemies there are those who are self-consciously and openly opposed to God while some merely seek their own pleasure and ends until the Lord opens their eyes. Kanye has repeatedly exalted himself like so many others before that God has opposed. I'm not opposed to someone having a conversation with him but it should be more like the conversation David had with Goliath: we fear the living God who will strike you blasphemer down unless you repent and turn to him. Not hey, let's make music together and see if you change your mind.

Not at all when it comes to Evangelism and Culture. Infact Van Til was very critical (Pretty harsh quite frankly) of Schaeffer found here:

http://www.chaleteagle.org/cybershelter/Study/95040A.htm

You are correct about people watering down the Truth that God has enemies. No one to label anyone an enemy of God...just a lost person. Well these lost people are rebelling against God until God redeems them. So they are actively suppressing the Truth to exalt idolatry.

So if Christians can't stand against God's enemies but want to Co-lab and even dress God's Enemies up in CHURCH CLOTHES (Emphasis mine) to seem spiritual then we must admit we are in the MOST BACKWARDS and COWARDLY AGE of Christianity on the books.

So I have been very critical about these advance and the REACH DELUSION and Anthony Bradley Delusion continues to emasculate our genre from Truth to Debauchery.

Be on the look out.... GOAT MUZIK.... not coming to any stores near you.

Grace and Peace,
seal

Apex
01-09-2014, 10:34 PM
I wonder.. do you all feel the same way about artists working with secular producers? Or even if they don't, artists that directly rip from songs of secular artists and pass them off as their own?

benjamin
01-09-2014, 11:21 PM
I wonder.. do you all feel the same way about artists working with secular producers? Or even if they don't, artists that directly rip from songs of secular artists and pass them off as their own?

I don't have a problem with collabs (depending on the content) but not with this clown. I thought the Lecrae/Krit track was solid.

I've used tracks from guys I know aren't believers. No problem there either. I hate, hate, hate the biting of popular beats though.

jeyjey34
01-09-2014, 11:31 PM
I wonder.. do you all feel the same way about artists working with secular producers? Or even if they don't, artists that directly rip from songs of secular artists and pass them off as their own?
It's not just about collaborating with a secular artist. It's about WHO the secular artist is. Not all collaborations are the same. Like Benjamin said, Lecrae working with Krit is different from working with Kanye.

What's the difference? The difference is that Kanye makes a mockery of Jesus and Christianity.

seal
01-09-2014, 11:50 PM
Alright so I'll start here. You obviously don't know Andy nor do you know Rich.(and that's not your fault) So let's start there. They go back to the T.R.U.C.E.(An urban music/drama/evangelist group that would do music and preach the gospel on city streets wherever they went. (T)o. (R)each. (U)rban. (C)ommunities. (E)verywhere. - Maybe you already knew this) days together, because they happened to meet back then. I met Rich and he had a burden to plant a church community where I now live of Washington Heights/Inwood area of NYC, a predominately Dominican neighborhood.

After much work and toil, myself and some others were part of the church plant which is now called Christ Crucified Fellowship which was originally planted through Acts 29 (Mark Driscoll's Church planting network which many of you despise). And we are being funded by a baptist church down in Pensacola, Florida called 'Olive Baptist Church' because we are only a few years old. We are building our Eldership, Deacons, leaders, Pastors, accountability with resources, finances, etc. because we are new and still growing. We began in my apartment then we moved to a boxing gym by God's grace where we can meet every sunday.

Andy was an active leader and community group leader in our small group within my house for a little while before his tours started kicking up. Through prayer and counsel, Rich (his friend, and obviously bad accountability partner) felt it was from the Lord to sit him down from being an active leader and community group leader because of the fact he would not be around a whole lot and we value community and devotion. Although they are friends, they are co-laborers, which I believe is biblical, and we are under authority, including Andy and Rich.

I know people who know your dude. That's how I knew Andy and your Pastor are buddies as well as co-laborers. So I don't expect buddies around the same age to really chastise one another. And if they do then I'm sure Andy has been sat down from touring..........Yeah right.......... No disrespect but these dudes don't have any accountability and they are hiding behind this "Art" and "Hip Hop" smokescreen to justify their methdology.





No offense to this statement, but I feel you did disrespect not only myself (because they are close personal friends and leaders of mine) but also them, what they stand for, do, and believe, and you don't know them - at all. For me it is personal, because emotions are real, and I live with these dudes, I live out community with them, I pray with them, argue with them, sharpen them and become sharpened and rebuked by them.

Kanye may not be of the faith, and I sat down with Andy on my couch and he was speaking to me about the entire interview which was 30 minutes long. He is a creative dude, with solid theology. Not perfect, because obviously none of us are, but a genuine dude, but you don't have to take my word for it because honestly, you don't know me either :). I visit these forums often and I don't say much any more, I mostly observe, and in my observations I can see sometimes my words wont register with anyone and they'll fall to the ground. However, on this particular place and time, I feel it is necessary to address you in love and honesty.

Well I don't have to know them to mark them as being reckless in public. If you have a public interview you need to know what you say in public only reflects what you don't say in public. Doctrinal purity or Unbiblical beliefs can not be hidden. I don't have to know Andy or your Pastor bro in order to know that he's wrong for saying Kanye is in a progression in his Faith. I don't. He's wrong. There's only one Faith. There are plenty of genuine Christians bro who believe erroneous beliefs. Doesn't make them fake but they are still wrong. And it needs to be pointed out that they are wrong and in need of repentance.

So don't take my remarks as condemnation to Hell....I am saying they are going to be judged by our King for propagating lies and misleading people with the purpose of helping them. It's quite oxy-moronic. We are not God and he doesn't need our bait and switch tactics.





I know you to be very zealous, outspoken, and for the truth, and I respect and admire that. You are very articulate and passionate about truth and God's holiness and mission. However, in my estimation, you are wrong for your words here. We're all going to be held accountable, which I'm certain you know.

You are correct, Kanye is unholy, and he is a blasphemer and he mocks God. Andy is a Christian who holds to the faith and the truth and the fact he wants to have a conversation is fine, and he'll probably never get to, who knows? I see your point about making music with him, which Andy told me he was sort of off guard with the question and looked at that answer as a more creative process, take it how you'd like.

Yeah.... which is typical. Just having another off day. Well people need to be called out for their off days and with REACH it has been a couple of OFF YEARS.... So they don't get the benefit of the doubt anymore. They are caught up in an idolatrous methodology and they need to repent.



You are entitled to your conviction and belief system about Reach, which I have nothing to say about Reach because I'm not with them. I'm with Andy and Rich, whom you mentioned in this message, which I am addressing. For my church family including Andy, he has not reached a state of delusion.



I much appreciate grace and I am for peace. I hope you are too.

He most certainly is and I pray he leaves Reach and starts his own Record Label.


Grace and Peace,
seal

Apex
01-10-2014, 12:17 AM
It's not just about collaborating with a secular artist. It's about WHO the secular artist is. Not all collaborations are the same. Like Benjamin said, Lecrae working with Krit is different from working with Kanye.

What's the difference? The difference is that Kanye makes a mockery of Jesus and Christianity.
So artists who are controversial regarding religion or Christianity are frowned upon but artists who are just as explicit or are even more explicit in their language or subject matter get a pass?

Ye and Krit are both explicit, but people are fine with the Krit collab. I would think people were fine with it because the end result (the song) actually served a meaningful purpose.

slimkid24
01-10-2014, 02:17 AM
I agree totally with reach records methodology towards reaching those within the hip hop community. I hope someone would like Andy mineo or whoever would get the opportunity to talk with Kanye. I don't see it as any different as speaking to a unbelieving coworker who makes a mockery of God. People need to chill, if you disagree, disagree. No need in calling people Cowards and other silly names.

Now back to my church clothes 2

The Light Within
01-10-2014, 02:30 AM
The Bible makes it clear that God does not condone compromising His standards:
“Joyful are people of integrity, who follow the instructions of the LORD. Joyful are those who obey His laws and search for Him with all their hearts. They do not compromise with evil, and they walk only in His paths. You have charged us to keep Your commandments carefully” (Psalm 119:1-4).

jeyjey34
01-10-2014, 11:36 AM
I agree totally with reach records methodology towards reaching those within the hip hop community. I hope someone would like Andy mineo or whoever would get the opportunity to talk with Kanye. I don't see it as any different as speaking to a unbelieving coworker who makes a mockery of God.
Again, the problem isn't with talking to Kanye. The problem is with making music with him.

plainoleme
01-10-2014, 11:39 AM
I wonder how yall woulda reacted when Solomon got them cedars from Lebanon for the temple...

jeyjey34
01-10-2014, 11:44 AM
I wonder how yall woulda reacted when Solomon got them cedars from Lebanon for the temple...
And what was the purpose of those cedars? (Easy question but I'm asking to make a point)

plainoleme
01-10-2014, 11:53 AM
It's not just about collaborating with a secular artist. It's about WHO the secular artist is. Not all collaborations are the same. Like Benjamin said, Lecrae working with Krit is different from working with Kanye.

What's the difference? The difference is that Kanye makes a mockery of Jesus and Christianity.

Sin in general makes mockery of God imo..

plainoleme
01-10-2014, 11:56 AM
And what was the purpose of those cedars? (Easy question but I'm asking to make a point) to build the temple

..But Solomon had to have a relationship with the King of Tyre to even be gifted those trees & artisans (who scripture doesn't identify as followers of the Jewish tradition)

K-Train
01-10-2014, 12:00 PM
So if Kanye made a beat for Andy to rap on.

Would you say Andy is compromising?

jeyjey34
01-10-2014, 12:02 PM
to build the temple


...To build the temple as a place to glorify and worship God. So, the Solomon example doesn't work unless you believe that Andy Mineo would work with Kanye to glorify God.

plainoleme
01-10-2014, 12:04 PM
i dont have a dog in this fight but i woulda loved to hear Andy on Addiction.
...To build the temple as a place to glorify and worship God. So, the Solomon example doesn't work unless you believe that Andy Mineo would work with Kanye to glorify God. I would assume (granted I could be wrong) that Andy attempts to (or at the very least believes) his work is done to glorify God, Andy would prolly be the best to ask concerning his mission (or at the very least JustinR, lol).

E.Gordo
01-10-2014, 12:56 PM
Since you guys want to use quotes to hate on people...
You all don't remember what Paul was before his conversion? He didn't necessarily mock God but he persecuted his people.
One thing you should know about God is that he can transform anyone. I don't hold Kanye on a pedestal at all. I think the dude could change through the Holy Spirit having the right people around him.
If Kanye is our enemy:


Luke 6
27But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you, 28Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you. 29And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not to take thy coat also. 30Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again. 31And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise. 32For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them. 33And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same. 34And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again. 35But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil. 36Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.


1 John 4:20
If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

1 John 3:15
Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.


The sad thing about Christians is that I see so many giving up on people and not even considering praying for them.
Does it cross your mind that God can take Kanye's life right now at this moment and he could die in his sins? Christ paid the price for his sins too. He even said those that blasphemy His name can be forgiven, showing His mercy. A lot of people doing evil are still alive because of God's mercy. Seems like the Christian house is divided...not a good look. Even if you don't like Kanye, just think of the glorious testimony he can bring to Christ if he changes. Everyone will witness how a man so deep in darkness was transformed by the Lord.

Apex
01-10-2014, 02:03 PM
Ignore my posts :)

benjamin
01-10-2014, 02:28 PM
Since you guys want to use quotes to hate on people...
You all don't remember what Paul was before his conversion? He didn't necessarily mock God but he persecuted his people.
One thing you should know about God is that he can transform anyone. I don't hold Kanye on a pedestal at all. I think the dude could change through the Holy Spirit having the right people around him.
If Kanye is our enemy:






The sad thing about Christians is that I see so many giving up on people and not even considering praying for them.
Does it cross your mind that God can take Kanye's life right now at this moment and he could die in his sins? Christ paid the price for his sins too. He even said those that blasphemy His name can be forgiven, showing His mercy. A lot of people doing evil are still alive because of God's mercy. Seems like the Christian house is divided...not a good look. Even if you don't like Kanye, just think of the glorious testimony he can bring to Christ if he changes. Everyone will witness how a man so deep in darkness was transformed by the Lord.

Don't mistake correctly identifying an enemy with giving up, not praying for, saying he's beyond hope. Rom 5 - we are all God's enemies, Eph 2 - we are all dead in sin, following the prince of the powers of the air.

What is being contested here is that the people of God shouldn't co-labor with those who have openly defied the living God. I pray that Kanye be born again and walk in the light. It is more than possible and worse sinners have been delivered. But that doesn't mean there has to be a partnership in the arts with him.

I think a lack of reading the OT (not saying you but American Christians in general) has led us to not recognize that people aggressively, and in some cases, violently oppose the living God. Kanye is more of the foolish, arrogant, blustering type but he still has mocked our Lord. God himself says he opposes the proud. Why make art with someone whom God is opposing? He needs to hear the gospel of truth and the command to repent and I pray that he heeds that gracious warning.

benjamin
01-10-2014, 02:32 PM
So artists who are controversial regarding religion or Christianity are frowned upon but artists who are just as explicit or are even more explicit in their language or subject matter get a pass?

Ye and Krit are both explicit, but people are fine with the Krit collab. I would think people were fine with it because the end result (the song) actually served a meaningful purpose.

I personally don't think that all sin is the same. Actually, I think that's one of the most harmful myths of American Christianity.

Krit is someone who seems to have displayed curiosity in the midst of "garden variety" sin. Some of his music is "conscious" and uplifting in a sense. Kanye has called himself a god, parodied our Lord's name, made a false image of him and mocked the true faith. These dudes are leagues apart. Kanye reminds of the cats that we are warned to avoid in Psalms 1 (stand in the way of sinners, sit in the seat of scoffers).

The apologist
01-10-2014, 02:55 PM
I personally don't think that all sin is the same. Actually, I think that's one of the most harmful myths of American Christianity.

Krit is someone who seems to have displayed curiosity in the midst of "garden variety" sin. Some of his music is "conscious" and uplifting in a sense. Kanye has called himself a god, parodied our Lord's name, made a false image of him and mocked the true faith. These dudes are leagues apart. Kanye reminds of the cats that we are warned to avoid in Psalms 1 (stand in the way of sinners, sit in the seat of scoffers).

Bang!!! This right here!!!

Apex
01-10-2014, 03:09 PM
I personally don't think that all sin is the same. Actually, I think that's one of the most harmful myths of American Christianity.

Krit is someone who seems to have displayed curiosity in the midst of "garden variety" sin. Some of his music is "conscious" and uplifting in a sense. Kanye has called himself a god, parodied our Lord's name, made a false image of him and mocked the true faith. These dudes are leagues apart. Kanye reminds of the cats that we are warned to avoid in Psalms 1 (stand in the way of sinners, sit in the seat of scoffers).
They aren't leagues apart, neither are Christians. Are you forgetting that while the way Kanye did what he did wasn't wise he did explain why he did them. From quoting Psalms 82:6 to having a pastor (regardless if he's questionable) to consult with on whether or not to include the "white Jesus" on stage with him. I really don't think they're as different as you think, both apparently raised with somewhat Christian influences, and neither are Christians. You can't honestly approve one over the other... both are really explicit.

benjamin
01-10-2014, 03:17 PM
They aren't leagues apart, neither are Christians. Are you forgetting that while the way Kanye did what he did wasn't wise he did explain why he did them. From quoting Psalms 82:6 to having a pastor (regardless if he's questionable) to consult with on whether or not to include the "white Jesus" on stage with him. I really don't think they're as different as you think, both apparently raised with somewhat Christian influences, and neither are Christians. You can't honestly approve one over the other... both are really explicit.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I see Kanye's actions (and his character in general) as more hardened or antagonistic to the gospel than someone like Krit, but I obviously don't know either one.

I'm not that interested in putting anyone on blast for a collab that hasn't even happened. I'd be opposed to it but don't want to be understood as being Andy's judge.

E.Gordo
01-10-2014, 03:21 PM
Sup Ben! Ya, I don't agree with Andy making music with the guy. Maybe until Kanye becomes a mature Christian. I just think since he is close to that industry, a talk wouldn't hurt. I don't think Andy is going to make a track on an album called "Kanye is God" or something.

I was speaking to a homeless person one day. He was labeled as troublemaker by everyone at the shelter, but I still said God bless you to him as he was leaving. As I said that, he turned around and told me "thank you, I noticed something different about you." I told him I don't judge by appearance but by the heart. "Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks."I'm not God, but that's how I can tell if there is some kind of good treasure there. So I was watching and listening to him too.

This homeless guy grew up in a church and had the Word in Him but he started doing drugs and whatnot. We had a long conversation about life, God, everything. If I had decided to ignore him and not say anything, we wouldn't have had the conversation. I've been through a lot of pain in my life myself. I know what pain can do to a man. Untold pain is the cause of a lot of habitual sin. So I recognize when someone is hurting. I told the homeless guy that I once wanted to take my life. Then he told me "I feel like doing that now." I told him I loved him and didn't want him to do it. I said God is more loving than I am and He definitely doesn't want you to do it. So that night, God placed in front of him perhaps to let him know that.

Jesus said, "we are the light of the world". I saw a quote that I really liked from a documentary. A guy said "In the absence of light, darkness reigns."

I can see why everyone has a beef with people doing songs with each other. But I see chh artists doing this as trying to build a relationship. Maybe these collabs have made no difference, or maybe it gets those people to think about God. A neighbor of mine told me about Christ and His love many years ago. Years later and after falling into a ditch, I remembered his words. Then my love for God grew because I finally saw that He was sending people to me to show me a better way. It took years though. Everyone should think about themselves and the sinful things they were doing before they knew God. If someone had not come up to you and shown you a better way, you might still be in your sins.

One more thing. I think there is too much emphasis on these rappers and songs. CHH as a ministry should only be a doorway. The Word of God is what people really ought to read and talk about. Those weaker in the faith need to be pointed back to it. That's another topic.

edit: To clarify things, I don't come to music to get my study of the Word. Its another tool used to honor and worship Him. If people are relying on music to become better Christians, I think that is a problem... If Andy does a collab with Kanye and Kanye doesn't say anything about God, it won't move me at all. Because I have the Word of God inside me and discernment. Those weaker in the faith need to be taught that music is not their Savior.

The Light Within
01-10-2014, 03:44 PM
Are you forgetting that while the way Kanye did what he did wasn't wise he did explain why he did them. From quoting Psalms 82:6 to having a pastor (regardless if he's questionable) to consult with on whether or not to include the "white Jesus" on stage with him.


Ye explains hisself http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/22/kanye-white-jesus-tour_n_4143553.htmlMost people won't even be able to discern how he's deceiving the masses. Such a smooth talker here.

Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up (Galatians 8:7-9).

Apex
01-10-2014, 04:56 PM
Most people won't even be able to discern how he's deceiving the masses. Such a smooth talker here.

Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up (Galatians 8:7-9).
You're right, the pastor doesn't exist and neither does the scripture. Oh wait..

The Light Within
01-10-2014, 05:24 PM
You're right, the pastor doesn't exist and neither does the scripture. Oh wait..

He's deceiving the masses by mocking Jesus in every way, shape, form and fashion and then he "politely" explains himself with such sweetness and all is well. Where is the discernment? I see a few on here have 20/20 vision and can see right through his masquerade. Yes, over the years I've prayed for him extensively, however this doesn't mean I don't see what he's trying to do.

Apex
01-10-2014, 07:00 PM
He's deceiving the masses by mocking Jesus in every way, shape, form and fashion and then he "politely" explains himself with such sweetness and all is well. Where is the discernment? I see a few on here have 20/20 vision and can see right through his masquerade. Yes, over the years I've prayed for him extensively, however this doesn't mean I don't see what he's trying to do.
You must be right. Idk what I was thinking!

Donald Chavis
01-11-2014, 05:17 PM
One does not simply "Bankrupt the gospel!"... lol I hear you using that Seal... What does it mean?

seal
01-12-2014, 12:05 AM
One does not simply "Bankrupt the gospel!"... lol I hear you using that Seal... What does it mean?

This methodology robs the Gospel of it's Worth.

What Bradley, John O, and Reach are portraying is that People are not Evil. They are victims of urban contexts like Fatherlessness, Poverty, and other social injustices. Thus people must be reached through relational methodology or "on their terms" before the Gospel becomes attractive. People must be told of their Potential and that they bear God's Image so God wants to use them. This is why they look at celebrities rap artist with such gaga eyes because they believe God can use this person to bring more people to Christ.

They are dead wrong and need to repent. Just go listen to the songs from plenty of artist as of late who have changed their message. Look at the co-labs. God doesn't need a celebrity pagan to bring people to himself. God uses his Spirit....Like He's been doing for Centuries. According to Scripture people are Evil and their environment isn't what caused it. They were born that way. Thus in ever context the Gospel is take supremacy and be the only dependency for people to be reconciled with God. People's potential mean absolutely nothing unless they repent.

Hit me up if you wanna get even more of a breakdown....


Grace and Peace,
seal

Apex
01-12-2014, 02:19 AM
This methodology robs the Gospel of it's Worth.

What Bradley, John O, and Reach are portraying is that People are not Evil. They are victims of urban contexts like Fatherlessness, Poverty, and other social injustices. Thus people must be reached through relational methodology or "on their terms" before the Gospel becomes attractive. People must be told of their Potential and that they bear God's Image so God wants to use them. This is why they look at celebrities rap artist with such gaga eyes because they believe God can use this person to bring more people to Christ.

They are dead wrong and need to repent. Just go listen to the songs from plenty of artist as of late who have changed their message. Look at the co-labs. God doesn't need a celebrity pagan to bring people to himself. God uses his Spirit....Like He's been doing for Centuries. According to Scripture people are Evil and their environment isn't what caused it. They were born that way. Thus in ever context the Gospel is take supremacy and be the only dependency for people to be reconciled with God. People's potential mean absolutely nothing unless they repent.

Hit me up if you wanna get even more of a breakdown....


Grace and Peace,
seal
Your delusion becomes more and more evident with each post you make on this board.. smh

Enlighten
01-12-2014, 02:45 AM
This methodology robs the Gospel of it's Worth.

What Bradley, John O, and Reach are portraying is that People are not Evil. They are victims of urban contexts like Fatherlessness, Poverty, and other social injustices. Thus people must be reached through relational methodology or "on their terms" before the Gospel becomes attractive. People must be told of their Potential and that they bear God's Image so God wants to use them. This is why they look at celebrities rap artist with such gaga eyes because they believe God can use this person to bring more people to Christ.

They are dead wrong and need to repent. Just go listen to the songs from plenty of artist as of late who have changed their message. Look at the co-labs. God doesn't need a celebrity pagan to bring people to himself. God uses his Spirit....Like He's been doing for Centuries. According to Scripture people are Evil and their environment isn't what caused it. They were born that way. Thus in ever context the Gospel is take supremacy and be the only dependency for people to be reconciled with God. People's potential mean absolutely nothing unless they repent.

Hit me up if you wanna get even more of a breakdown....


Grace and Peace,
seal

I prefer you to site your source because I re-read Bradley's article didnt see him say anything about humanity not being evil and never heard John O. say the likes of these things. While you're still wait for Bradley to Reply you can email John O. any disagreements you have on what he has said.

plainoleme
01-12-2014, 07:49 AM
Seal talmbout Jawno got me In my feelings lol

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view7/4400473/stinkmeaner-tom-chest-kick-o.gif

seal
01-12-2014, 02:25 PM
Your delusion becomes more and more evident with each post you make on this board.. smh

Get ya post game up before you approach the kid.....LOL....


I prefer you to site your source because I re-read Bradley's article didnt see him say anything about humanity not being evil and never heard John O. say the likes of these things. While you're still wait for Bradley to Reply you can email John O. any disagreements you have on what he has said.

John O made his video private called "Dignity from the Gospel" but I've had multiple people watch and several Elders from my church watched it as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iu69c2ya0MQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Bradley has plenty of articles up and me and him went back and forth on Twitter when he was promoting Lecrae and Keller where he blatantly asserts that they understand the Gospel from the Genesis 1&2 context.

Anthony Bradley ‏@drantbradley 9 Sep
Keller & Lecrae understand the gospel begining in Gen. 1 & 2. Their Calvinist critics tend to start only with Gen. 3 http://blog.acton.org/archives/58497-a-conflict-of-christian-visions-gen-1-2-vs-gen-3-christianity.html …


And Shane you of all people know where I am coming from on this. I am not pulling this stuff out of no where. People must be made aware of the horrific Doctrine and philosophy that has affected a genre that has impacted their lives and why it's going sour except for the few Faithful. Not to mention in every age of the Church we've had this same issue. People who are Bold for Christ and the People who develop methods not to be Bold for Christ to lighten their conscience. In their heart of hearts they know they wrong.


Grace and Peace,
seal

The apologist
01-12-2014, 03:16 PM
Your delusion becomes more and more evident with each post you make on this board.. smh
Seal maybe abrasive but he's right on point on this.

seal
01-12-2014, 03:21 PM
Seal maybe abrasive but he's right on point on this.

Abrasive.... I am being nice...LOL...

The Light Within
01-12-2014, 05:49 PM
I've got to co sign with a few things seal is saying on this mayter. There are many people I know who aren't saved that won't listen to one single song where the artist is going hard for Christ, but they will listen to Church Clothes 2. They tell me they can ride with it because it makes them feel like Lecrae accepts them as they are and they don't feel convicted to change. They will not for the life of them listen to anything where the artist is going hard for Christ. If the unsaved see us as compromising the true gospel, what's next? The great deception won't necessarily come to us in the form of horns...Satan capitalizes on our love of the light in order to deceive. He wants us to think that he is good, truthful, loving, and powerful, essentially all the things that God is. To portray himself as a dark, devilish being with horns would not be very appealing to the majority of people. Most people are not drawn to darkness, but to light. Therefore, Satan appears as a creature of light to draw us to himself and his lies (false teaching).

plainoleme
01-12-2014, 05:57 PM
[COLOR="#000000"][SIZE=3]
John O made his video private called "Dignity from the Gospel" but I've had multiple people watch and several Elders from my church watched it as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iu69c2ya0MQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player


That was the video that dropped in August right? And Jawn-o was like we needed to begin with Imago Dei rather than the fall as a starting point for evangelism. I took it as him drawing on/appealing to the beauty of our shared humanity in how we're sposed to be rather than the ugliness of where we are. I understand how this can be miscontrued, "blame the sin v blame the sinner v. blame others" however. I cant speak for the brother though, like dude said ask him..

But I do think that just being guided by truth in love, we can evangelize n preach the gospel and have differing approaches so long as all roads lead to the cross. Lemme be more specific before someone hems me up on semantics, lol. IJS if he is saying that all men were made in Gods image and drawing on that im okay, with that. From the times Ive heard him & DA speak I never heard them saying fatherlessness, alcohol were scapegoats but rather tangible manifestations of the fall.

Donald Chavis
01-12-2014, 06:39 PM
Thanks Seal... I may have to listen or read what those you accuse are saying because I don't see them openly saying what you say they are saying. And I met your homie Tope today at church. Thanks

Enlighten
01-12-2014, 09:08 PM
John O made his video private called "Dignity from the Gospel" but I've had multiple people watch and several Elders from my church watched it as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iu69c2ya0MQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Bradley has plenty of articles up and me and him went back and forth on Twitter when he was promoting Lecrae and Keller where he blatantly asserts that they understand the Gospel from the Genesis 1&2 context.

Anthony Bradley ‏@drantbradley 9 Sep
Keller & Lecrae understand the gospel begining in Gen. 1 & 2. Their Calvinist critics tend to start only with Gen. 3 http://blog.acton.org/archives/58497-a-conflict-of-christian-visions-gen-1-2-vs-gen-3-christianity.html …


And Shane you of all people know where I am coming from on this. I am not pulling this stuff out of no where. People must be made aware of the horrific Doctrine and philosophy that has affected a genre that has impacted their lives and why it's going sour except for the few Faithful. Not to mention in every age of the Church we've had this same issue. People who are Bold for Christ and the People who develop methods not to be Bold for Christ to lighten their conscience. In their heart of hearts they know they wrong.


Grace and Peace,
seal

As one of John O's prodigies I can you tell that video was mainly about how that Gospel gives us dignity, He would tell you that the video was to talk about the "starting point" in sharing the gospel. Man's deficiencies aren't understood properly unless they are expressed as a distortion of his dignity that's all. Wasn't meant to be a comprehensive picture of the gospel (no mention of substitution, atonement, resurrection, etc). But He is working on a write up to better explain the video which was misunderstood if you want is email you can pm me and yall can dialouge.

I dont see eye to eye with you on Bradley's article it's more about Mission styles and even when he explain the Frame of Gen 1-2 I still dont see statements like this as heretical unless you believe that only believes share in the Imago Dei while of Course fallen man bears a fallen image. But even Scripture claims that about man regardless of being fallen or not Gen. 9:6 and Jas. 3:9


In a Genesis 1 and 2 framework, everything matters in God’s redemptive plan. As such, every person matters to God because they bear his image, and the Holy Spirit uses the evangelicalism of God’s people to unite men and women to Christ. The rest of creation and culture also matter to God because, in the mystery of God’s redemptive plan, we play a role in seeing that the cosmos brings glory to God (1 Cor 10:31, Col 3:23). The emphasis here is God’s sovereignty and mission for the whole creation.

While I cant Speak for Bradley from what I've read he's not trying to negate Gen 3 but he's just explains 1 and 2 give us the rest picture. In 1 and 2 man was created for fellowship with God and also in that fellowship man had dignity but that fellowship was broken and our dignity has distorted when we look at Gen 3 with the fall.

With Bradley's article as said before what I got from the article was this:


In the end, the Gen 1 and 2 framework sees the missionary mandate and the commission to create and steward cultures that glorify God as a “both/and” while the Gen 3 framework tends to see the missionary disciple-making mandate exclusively as the Christian’s main concern. For Gen 3ers, the cultural emphasis is merely an implication or application of the gospel as opposed to the restoration of creation as something to which the gospel directly points.

If there's something I've missed in what you read that affirms your points please let me know. While Video is private I can give you the expand version since it was for a sermon series he did called the Imago Dei. I still dont see the mentions of fallen man being good or not really evil but just victims of their environments.

I dont think this Gen 1&2 framework is making people less bold. The lack of boldness cant say it's on the Doctrine if anything it's the fear of man.

Ras
01-14-2014, 03:10 PM
Via Jam The Hype:


Andy Mineo has been making a lot of noise this year and were not even a month into it. Mineo is dropping Saturday Morning Car-Tunez (Season 2: EP. 2 – “Making Never Land) videos every Saturday in January, gearing up to release his Never Land EP and appearing on major media outlets like MTV. The Syracuse, New York- emcee is definitely on the grind.

The Never Land-crafter recently made news when he told Rob Markman of MTV News that he would like to build with Kanye West. The Andy stories on mainstream networks aren’t stopping yet.

Markman released another interesting Andy Mineo story today (January 14). The legendary Hip Hop journalist announced that his interview with Andy Mineo will air on MTV.com & MTV Jams January 15 at 4pm EST. Andy will make his return to MTV’s “RapFix Live” alongside Action Bronson & The LOX, two well-known Hip Hop artists. Mineo will talk about wanting to be known as a skilled rapper, who also happens to be true to his faith and how it’s been hard to carry the torch of Christian Rap, among other things.

Check out the promo for the upcoming MTV interview below:

http://www.mtv.com/videos/news/993802/andy-mineo-says-give-the-music-a-chance.jhtml

Can't wait for the Andy>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kiss comments.

jeyjey34
01-14-2014, 03:27 PM
http://www.mtv.com/videos/news/993802/andy-mineo-says-give-the-music-a-chance.jhtml


"I hope people listen to the music, don't write it off because there's a christian doing it.... If I'm honest with you, Christian Rap for the most part has been corny. It's been wack and that's why sometimes I really don't enjoy that title because I feel like someone won't give me a chance because they're negatively associating it with everything they've heard in the past..."

--Andy Mineo, a graduate of the Lecrae School of Hip Hop

plainoleme
01-14-2014, 03:28 PM
Can't wait for the Andy>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kiss comments.

high heresy. sn: Part of me cringes when i here christians dont want the christian label, admittedly ive been guilty of it. It makes me think of Matthew 10:33, but I do understand theres more to denying christ than just a label, so perhaps im just being superficial. or perhaps im projecting my own guilt onto him n trying to toss my burden/convictions on another
--Andy Mineo, a graduate of the Lecrae School of Hip Hophttp://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4rocyT1XD1rn95k2o1_500.gif

Ras
01-14-2014, 03:30 PM
"I hope people listen to the music, don't write it off because there's a christian doing it.... If I'm honest with you, Christian Rap for the most part has been corny. It's been wack and that's why sometimes I really don't enjoy that title because I feel like someone won't give me a chance because they're negatively associating it with everything they've heard in the past..."

--Andy Mineo, a graduate of the Lecrae School of Hip Hop

http://i.imgur.com/IK1K5aL.png

Apex
01-14-2014, 03:41 PM
high heresy. sn: Part of me cringes when i here christians dont want the christian label, admittedly ive been guilty of it. It makes me think of Matthew 10:33, but I do understand theres more to denying christ than just a label, so perhaps im just being superficial. or perhaps im projecting my own guilt onto him n trying to toss my burden/convictions on another
I'm an artist. I don't want any labels either.

plainoleme
01-14-2014, 03:47 PM
I'm an artist. I don't want any labels either.I feel you.

Bauman1535
01-14-2014, 03:47 PM
"I hope people listen to the music, don't write it off because there's a christian doing it.... If I'm honest with you, Christian Rap for the most part has been corny. It's been wack and that's why sometimes I really don't enjoy that title because I feel like someone won't give me a chance because they're negatively associating it with everything they've heard in the past..."

--Andy Mineo, a graduate of the Lecrae School of Hip Hop

If I remember right, I think Phanatik addressed (in one of his books) a quote from Lecrae that was almost identical to this. I get what Andy is trying to do and say, but it's a spit in the face to CM and every other pre-2012 CHH artist/group that has been pumping out quality music for decades.

benjamin
01-14-2014, 03:52 PM
"I hope people listen to the music, don't write it off because there's a christian doing it.... If I'm honest with you, Christian Rap for the most part has been corny. It's been wack and that's why sometimes I really don't enjoy that title because I feel like someone won't give me a chance because they're negatively associating it with everything they've heard in the past..."

--Andy Mineo, a graduate of the Lecrae School of Hip Hop

That mantra is getting old. It's like throwing other cats under the bus to separate oneself.

Besides, you only have to browse a few pages of DatPiff or Soundcloud to find loads of wack hip hop, no label necessary.

Ras
01-14-2014, 03:55 PM
Here's Json's view on hip hop art and the church via twitter:


There is, has been, & will always be amazing things done by the Church. Highlight That!!!!!!



Real talk this continued talk of how bad our art & everything else we do is getting real lame & old.



I'm tired of hearing so many talk about what the church does bad or poorly. Airing it out to those who don't care for the church. Not good

plainoleme
01-14-2014, 04:02 PM
Here's Json's view on hip hop art and the church via twitter: Didnt Json say some ppl were wack in that last Lampmode video tho..

Ras
01-14-2014, 04:08 PM
With him and Lecrae I don't get how they don't see that other Christian rappers would not be offended by that. I get that it's their opinion. But to me when they say these things, I wonder do they think about how the Christian rap community feels about it. Or do they really care as long as that secular audience listens to their music? I'm sure this will def. draw out some more convo and maybe Andy can clarify it. He's obviously a Christian rap fan of the past with his mentions of Corey & Precise twice (sampling Precise, mentioning Corey on Ayo!)

plainoleme
01-14-2014, 04:14 PM
With him and Lecrae I don't get how they don't see that other Christian rappers would not be offended by that. I get that it's their opinion. But to me when they say these things, I wonder do they think about how the Christian rap community feels about it. Or do they really care as long as that secular audience listens to their music? I'm sure this will def. draw out some more convo and maybe Andy can clarify it. He's obviously a Christian rap fan of the past with his mentions of Corey & Precise twice (sampling Precise, mentioning Corey on Ayo!)

I see them doing it in a Kendrick/Drake kinda way where they are making the distinction of yeah I'm not like them at the same time holding the position I don't have any issue with you guys, I just think you suck (or at the very least im better). Also I don't think they care deep down, at least not to the level that would cause them to stop.

*Drake's been doing that a lot lately talmbout how his features make ppl get sales n how he's better & everyone sucks, meanwhile he's peers & collaborators with these people. It's a rap double standard I suppose.

** I see this a lot where I live (757), people in VA will say it's wack here and the people will lame. Yet in the same breath frequent venues and associate with people from here. I guess it's not just a rap thing.

Ras
01-14-2014, 04:15 PM
Didnt Json say some ppl were wack in that last Lampmode video tho..

I think you're right but I'm sure some would view that as more of "in house" type of video. Personally, I think it's a way to say what Andy said but in a different way. Like saying look I can understand your experience with Christian rap in the past. But don't hold me to what you heard.

No different then talking to a non-Christian about going "to church". You can empathize with a person about their experience, wackness in the church. Without saying that most of the church is "wack". But my church is different sorta thing. Again, I get where Andy is coming from. But at the same type the way he states it is more "dividing".

Ras
01-14-2014, 04:23 PM
As far as most CHH is wack, I would probably ask Andy to clarify. Because I'm sure if someone pressed he's a fan of a lot Christian rap.

The apologist
01-14-2014, 04:23 PM
With him and Lecrae I don't get how they don't see that other Christian rappers would not be offended by that. I get that it's their opinion. But to me when they say these things, I wonder do they think about how the Christian rap community feels about it. Or do they really care as long as that secular audience listens to their music? I'm sure this will def. draw out some more convo and maybe Andy can clarify it. He's obviously a Christian rap fan of the past with his mentions of Corey & Precise twice (sampling Precise, mentioning Corey on Ayo!)
I don't get it either SMH

jeyjey34
01-14-2014, 04:28 PM
As far as most CHH is wack, I would probably ask Andy to clarify. Because I'm sure if someone pressed he's a fan of a lot Christian rap.
We all know that there is bad CHH out there. The question is whether MOST of it is bad. What do you think?

plainoleme
01-14-2014, 04:28 PM
I think you're right but I'm sure some would view that as more of "in house" type of video. Personally, I think it's a way to say what Andy said but in a different way. Like saying look I can understand your experience with Christian rap in the past. But don't hold me to what you heard.

I agree, I just felt like someone was gon bring that up so I said it first.

plainoleme
01-14-2014, 04:31 PM
He said most CHH is corny, not wack though that can mean the same thing. We all know that there is bad CHH out there. The question is whether MOST of it is bad. What do you think?

I think most CHH is corny, I think most mainstream rap is wack. I can name names but I'd rather not be divisive. Nonetheless I think that there is many quality acts in both genres, enough to not continue this neverending topic.

At the same time when I hear ppl say they rap in either I assume their trash, hence the reason I never tell anyone Im a christian who raps, dont wanna be lumped in with the rest.

Ras
01-14-2014, 04:44 PM
We all know that there is bad CHH out there. The question is whether MOST of it is bad. What do you think?

By my standards, yeah it is. But that's because there isn't a lot freedom in the genre to be experimental, lack of different genres in CHH in comparsion to "regular" hip hop where there is way more variety,. And I'm not talking about the radio obviously. Too much following trends (which ironically Andy is apart of that at times with his C-Draking), bad mixing, etc. But there def. is some good stuff out there though.

The Light Within
01-14-2014, 05:15 PM
If I'm honest with you, Christian Rap for the most part has been corny. It's been wack and that's why sometimes I really don't enjoy that title because I feel like someone won't give me a chance because they're negatively associating it with everything they've heard in the past..."

--Andy Mineo, a graduate of the Lecrae School of Hip Hop

If I'm honest with all, his music isn't that good, game changing, nor very edifying...maybe because he's so involved with trying to shed the label? I don't really know, but what I do know is that we shouldn't care how the world receives what we do in Christ. We should all be going hard for Christ and letting people know who it is we serve and who it is we worship. I let artists know if they are edifying and uplifiting on here, so I'll also let them know if what they are doing is coming across worldly. Give me music that is Christ saturated and Holy Spirit inspired, or be like the rest of the world and blend in. What happened to go hard or go home?

Apex
01-14-2014, 05:33 PM
The idea of CHH is pretty wack to me honestly, especially compared to other forms of art.

jeyjey34
01-14-2014, 05:40 PM
The idea of CHH is pretty wack to me honestly, especially compared to other forms of art.
Then why are you on this website?

jeyjey34
01-14-2014, 05:41 PM
Tony from Hazakim's thoughts on Facebook:

"A bit dissapointed with some of the statements coming from certain of my brothers in the Lord who have enjoyed some mainstream attention. C'mon brothers...this is not the time for us to beg the secular world to "give us a chance". God has been giving them a chance for thousands of years and now we find ourselves in moral decay. Take Messiah out of your music and then they'll certainly "give you a chance". They dont really want to hear about Jesus when they're on their way to indulge the flesh at the club, even if we work really hard to mimmick the sounds of the club (which is another topic altogether). Our Lord said his message is only for "those who have ears to hear".... why can't we be content with that?"
- Tony

Apex
01-14-2014, 05:56 PM
Then why are you on this website?
What does the made up rules for what is and isn't allowed in CHH have to do with being on a website?

benjamin
01-14-2014, 05:56 PM
The idea of CHH is pretty wack to me honestly, especially compared to other forms of art.

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/you-dont-say.gif

The Light Within
01-14-2014, 06:19 PM
The idea of CHH is pretty wack to me honestly, especially compared to other forms of art.

That statement right there is what many atheists say. In fact, I've only ever heard this from atheists. Care to elaborate?

Apex
01-14-2014, 06:44 PM
That statement right there is what many atheists say. In fact, I've only ever heard this from atheists. Care to elaborate?
Funny. The fact that there is even a thread on this upsets me even more. http://forum.holyculture.net/showthread.php?62977-Prerequisites-for-CHH

Ragnarok
01-14-2014, 06:52 PM
I'm an artist. I don't want any labels either.
can you post a link to your music. Thanks

Apex
01-14-2014, 06:58 PM
can you post a link to your music. Thanks
I'm not a rapper..

Ras
01-14-2014, 07:03 PM
I'm not a rapper..

http://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/1361933128_tumblr_lv9e5d7O091qe6g2k.gif

shekinahsmoke
01-15-2014, 09:22 AM
http://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/1361933128_tumblr_lv9e5d7O091qe6g2k.gif



Ras you always aim AND please.

Believin Stephen
01-15-2014, 09:44 AM
I wrote this on May 1, 2012 and still believe it holds true.

I believe the genre of Christian hip-hop has an inferiority complex. Let me explain. Due to previous negative connotations from the world who tend to think CHH is corny or wack we tend to go along with that view of the genre. Many people have only been exposed to have a few Christian hip-hop songs or projects and it may very well be true that the projects or songs they heard were indeed wack or corny.

However, due to not being accepted by the mainstream throughout the years we agree with them that CHH is wack..”except for me and my crew” mentality. Yes there are lots of wack rappers who are Christian just like there are lots of wack rappers who are not Christian. If you talk to most CHH rappers or whatever title they wanna be called you’ll find they think CHH is wack. I know this from being friends with them or by talking to them at events. So what new stuff have you been bumping? They will normally name a few people in their crew and say that is it and then express their disappointment with CHH. Yet how many have really dug deep and listened to a lot of the most skilled CHH albums/mixtapes? If someone has done that and still is disappointed and thinks CHH is wack then I can respect that. It is true that there is lots of room for improvement amongst CHH artists and it is true that some are wack. But this is the same with secular as well.

In sports, we have Christians who have been successful in their sports like Ray Lewis in football, Lin in basketball, Watson in golf, Pujols in baseball, Allyson Felix in track. And that’s just a small list. There are mad other successful skilled professional athletes who are Christians. They have more skill and have been more successful than their secular counterparts. Yet, we have an inferiority complex of Christians who rap and doubt that any can be as skilled as our secular counterparts. Why?

As my bol Ackdavis tweeted last week I’m convinced there are a rack of Christian mcs who are way better than their secular counterparts. This conclusion is made after listening to both genres. Yes, secular cats have bigger budgets and better promotion; better videos, better tours, graphics, etc--but I'm just talking about skills on the mic. I think in the next few years what I just tweeted will make more sense due to Christians gaining more exposure by mainstream secular media. But I don’t think we need to wait for the acceptance of the mainstream to start believing it now that there are Christians who are sick rappers! I’m not saying all this to say our main goal should be to prove that Christians are better than non-Christians. I am writing this because I know the mind state of many involved in hip-hop who are Christians needs to change. I believe this inferiority complex is one of the main reasons why Christian artists have a tendency to bite more well-known secular artists. They are looking up to them as the standard of what excellence is instead of making the best art possible. Let’s stop sleeping on how gifted some of our fellow Christian rappers are and stop thinking we have to be ashamed to be called Christian rappers.

5 years ago I started working for Temple University. For anyone out there who follows college football you know very well that they were the laughing stock of college football for many years. They hadn't had a winning season since 1990 and the previous year (2006) they were 1-11. I remember my boss- the head strength coach echoing the message of the coaching staff that I was about to be apart of something special. He told me I was about to be apart of one of the biggest turnarounds in college football history. I was skeptical at the time but he was right. In 2007 the Owls snapped their 20 game losing streak and ended 4-8. The next year they lost some close games and could have had a winning record but finished 5-7. The losing mentality was starting to change into a winning mentality. They started to believe that they WERE NOT LOSERS but they were WINNERS. I left for a job at Pitt in early 2009 but that year they went 9-4 and went to their first bowl game in over 30 years. This past year they won a bowl game and sent 10 players to the NFL (3 drafted; 7 free agent signings) I remember wearing my Temple hoody to get food one day back in 2008 and someone asking me "Are you serious? Do you really represent those bums?". The name had a negative connotation. However, Temple did not change their name to become successful and change that connotation. Changing the name is the easy way out. They worked hard and believed they could succeed.

If we continually listen to what everyone around us tell us "CHH is corny and wack" we will continue to believe what everyone tells us. Instead, I recommend us believing that God has given us gifts and talents to do our art in excellence for His glory. A change in name is not needed for us to be accepted by others, nor should acceptance be our goal. Galatians 1:10, "Are we seeking to please man or Christ? If I were seeking to please man, I would not be a bond servant of Christ."

plainoleme
01-15-2014, 10:05 AM
the fact we're still talking about this is disheartening, why it has to be "either or" rather than "both and" is beyond me.

There is "good and bad" in all aspects of live, the measurment is most always subjective. For the life of me I never understand the comparisons McDonalds is a restaurant as is RuthCris, the existence of so many MCD's should have no bearing on Ruthcris and yet we continue to lump these unrealistic comparisons in other areas of life. It's ridiculous & imature. Then we have proponents with better resources, skill, marketshare talk down, make distance and division on people in their field. I say let each man stand on his own and be measured. The comparisons positive/conscious v. explicitly christian, talented v. wack, underground v. mainstream etc.. are moot and foolish. ...... im sleep tho *steps off soapbox

shekinahsmoke
01-15-2014, 10:56 AM
I wrote this on May 1, 2012 and still believe it holds true.

I believe the genre of Christian hip-hop has an inferiority complex. Let me explain. Due to previous negative connotations from the world who tend to think CHH is corny or wack we tend to go along with that view of the genre. Many people have only been exposed to have a few Christian hip-hop songs or projects and it may very well be true that the projects or songs they heard were indeed wack or corny.

However, due to not being accepted by the mainstream throughout the years we agree with them that CHH is wack..”except for me and my crew” mentality. Yes there are lots of wack rappers who are Christian just like there are lots of wack rappers who are not Christian. If you talk to most CHH rappers or whatever title they wanna be called you’ll find they think CHH is wack. I know this from being friends with them or by talking to them at events. So what new stuff have you been bumping? They will normally name a few people in their crew and say that is it and then express their disappointment with CHH. Yet how many have really dug deep and listened to a lot of the most skilled CHH albums/mixtapes? If someone has done that and still is disappointed and thinks CHH is wack then I can respect that. It is true that there is lots of room for improvement amongst CHH artists and it is true that some are wack. But this is the same with secular as well.

In sports, we have Christians who have been successful in their sports like Ray Lewis in football, Lin in basketball, Watson in golf, Pujols in baseball, Allyson Felix in track. And that’s just a small list. There are mad other successful skilled professional athletes who are Christians. They have more skill and have been more successful than their secular counterparts. Yet, we have an inferiority complex of Christians who rap and doubt that any can be as skilled as our secular counterparts. Why?

As my bol Ackdavis tweeted last week I’m convinced there are a rack of Christian mcs who are way better than their secular counterparts. This conclusion is made after listening to both genres. Yes, secular cats have bigger budgets and better promotion; better videos, better tours, graphics, etc--but I'm just talking about skills on the mic. I think in the next few years what I just tweeted will make more sense due to Christians gaining more exposure by mainstream secular media. But I don’t think we need to wait for the acceptance of the mainstream to start believing it now that there are Christians who are sick rappers! I’m not saying all this to say our main goal should be to prove that Christians are better than non-Christians. I am writing this because I know the mind state of many involved in hip-hop who are Christians needs to change. I believe this inferiority complex is one of the main reasons why Christian artists have a tendency to bite more well-known secular artists. They are looking up to them as the standard of what excellence is instead of making the best art possible. Let’s stop sleeping on how gifted some of our fellow Christian rappers are and stop thinking we have to be ashamed to be called Christian rappers.

5 years ago I started working for Temple University. For anyone out there who follows college football you know very well that they were the laughing stock of college football for many years. They hadn't had a winning season since 1990 and the previous year (2006) they were 1-11. I remember my boss- the head strength coach echoing the message of the coaching staff that I was about to be apart of something special. He told me I was about to be apart of one of the biggest turnarounds in college football history. I was skeptical at the time but he was right. In 2007 the Owls snapped their 20 game losing streak and ended 4-8. The next year they lost some close games and could have had a winning record but finished 5-7. The losing mentality was starting to change into a winning mentality. They started to believe that they WERE NOT LOSERS but they were WINNERS. I left for a job at Pitt in early 2009 but that year they went 9-4 and went to their first bowl game in over 30 years. This past year they won a bowl game and sent 10 players to the NFL (3 drafted; 7 free agent signings) I remember wearing my Temple hoody to get food one day back in 2008 and someone asking me "Are you serious? Do you really represent those bums?". The name had a negative connotation. However, Temple did not change their name to become successful and change that connotation. Changing the name is the easy way out. They worked hard and believed they could succeed.

If we continually listen to what everyone around us tell us "CHH is corny and wack" we will continue to believe what everyone tells us. Instead, I recommend us believing that God has given us gifts and talents to do our art in excellence for His glory. A change in name is not needed for us to be accepted by others, nor should acceptance be our goal. Galatians 1:10, "Are we seeking to please man or Christ? If I were seeking to please man, I would not be a bond servant of Christ."

thank you for this .

shekinahsmoke
01-15-2014, 11:42 AM
Future. He going in on twitter. This is a real thing. MEANWHILE, Jerrell Johnson is a genius freestyler on Jamthehype.com/TV/ I mean it's like so smooth... his mind is ridiculous.

plainoleme
01-15-2014, 11:50 AM
STL or Future or crooner Future?

Ras
01-15-2014, 03:06 PM
STL or Future or crooner Future?

https://twitter.com/Futureinchrist

Ras
01-15-2014, 03:19 PM
Andy's statement on the MTV interview



Today my first major MTV interview is airing! I’m excited about it, but, I also want to share a few things w those tuning in. Those interviews are so tough. So much is running through my mind as I think through how to navigate each answer on the spot. I’m constantly pondering how to be honest, faithful, considerate of all parties watching and biblically accurate. All while knowing everything is being recorded and can and will be scrutinized by the internet. Simply put, there’s a lot of pressure and never enough time to fully explain each statement. I am not beyond making mistakes. I can and will. I definitely could have chosen my words more carefully to consider my audience better in this interview. I’m learning. My apologies go out to anyone who may be offended by some of my statements on air. I appreciate those that have taken the time to call out error in love. Pray for me as I continue to grow and learn to be an effective missionary in hip hop culture.

jeyjey34
01-15-2014, 03:42 PM
http://andymineo.tumblr.com/post/73421963620/mtv-interview

Ras
01-15-2014, 04:34 PM
He's on now for those who have MTV Jams.

mzsoulll
01-15-2014, 04:55 PM
lol. C-Lite's...I mean Andy's apology was wack. I will most definitely accept his request and begin keeping him and Reach in prayer, but let's please keep it real! Dissing CHH had nothing to do with stage fright or being put on the spot. That was clearly the result of the tacky ideologies spinning around the reach records camp. Lecrae has been hinting it every chance he gets. Andy Lite just gave away too much too fast. He may have gone loose goose because of the pressure, but ain't nothing come out of his mouth that wasn't in his heart. #sorrynotsorry

I don't respect that. All that blog indicates is that he's aware that he stepped in some big dog doo-doo. It doesn't indicate any awareness of the real issue. I hope that changes. *sips water*

sidebar: It's beyond crazy to me that they think they're that hot to diss the genre that birthed them! I'm not eem gon' say nothing about that. #byefelicia

Cowboy
01-15-2014, 05:34 PM
Hey guys, what's going on? Anything new?

The apologist
01-15-2014, 06:07 PM
Hey guys, what's going on? Anything new?

Ha Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ras
01-15-2014, 09:51 PM
http://wadeoradio.com/sketch-david-debate-andy-mineos-christian-rap-corny-comments/

D. Daniels and SKetch view on this.

shekinahsmoke
01-16-2014, 01:28 PM
lol. C-Lite's...I mean Andy's apology was wack. I will most definitely accept his request and begin keeping him and Reach in prayer, but let's please keep it real! Dissing CHH had nothing to do with stage fright or being put on the spot. That was clearly the result of the tacky ideologies spinning around the reach records camp. Lecrae has been hinting it every chance he gets. Andy Lite just gave away too much too fast. He may have gone loose goose because of the pressure, but ain't nothing come out of his mouth that wasn't in his heart. #sorrynotsorry

I don't respect that. All that blog indicates is that he's aware that he stepped in some big dog doo-doo. It doesn't indicate any awareness of the real issue. I hope that changes. *sips water*

sidebar: It's beyond crazy to me that they think they're that hot to diss the genre that birthed them! I'm not eem gon' say nothing about that. #byefelicia

byefelicia!!!! ROFL!!! *somebody hand me a towel*

Enlighten
01-16-2014, 01:56 PM
Here's what I feel about the Latest words of Andy http://forthdistrict.com/the-delusion-of-christian-hip-hop/

The apologist
01-16-2014, 03:01 PM
Here's what I feel about the Latest words of Andy http://forthdistrict.com/the-delusion-of-christian-hip-hop/
Dope article brother! Thanks!

aficianado_jc
01-16-2014, 04:17 PM
Here's what I feel about the Latest words of Andy http://forthdistrict.com/the-delusion-of-christian-hip-hop/

You got this one figured out for sure. Christians romanticize mainstream artists too much in rap, singing, acting, etc. Good read.

The Light Within
01-17-2014, 05:52 PM
Just came across this article. Not that it holds much weight, but it's worth checking out nonetheless.


In fact, Tireo, also a book author, film and movie director and actor, feels so strongly about Lecrae — and some other gospel performers — being, as he put it, “phony”, that he has produced at least two videos to “expose these false” Christian rappers to the world.

Tireo, real name Tireo Hammond, has accused Lecrae in a lengthy video of “selling his soul” to major music distributors in order to seal big record deals. He suggested that this 33 year old president, co-owner and co-founder of Reach Records, an independent record label, was guilty of not telling the truth about Jesus Christ or the gospel in his music so he could get the backing of these Christian music companies.

He challenged people, not to take his word for it, but check the lyrics of Lecrae’s releases and judge for themselves. The rap singer said he was frustrated with “these fake Christian artists”, and believes a lot of people were too. Tireo told his audience that Jesus said not to be deceived.

http://www.barbadostoday.bb/2013/05/10/worldwide-message/

Cowboy
01-17-2014, 06:10 PM
Just came across this article. Not that it holds much weight, but it's worth checking out nonetheless.



http://www.barbadostoday.bb/2013/05/10/worldwide-message/

Let's just go ahead and get this out of the way: Tireo is crazy.

Feel however you want about Lecrae and Reach's approach, but Tireo is the guy that we've posted videos of a year or two ago that is on some sort of Ringo/G. Craig/recently-released-from-the-loony-bin steez. He has an album where he raps as Jesus.

Let me repeat that: he has an album where he raps AS JESUS.

Search for one of his videos on YouTube and you'll see the craziness for yourself. All that to say: no, this is not worth checking out.

Apex
01-17-2014, 06:15 PM
Let's just go ahead and get this out of the way: Tireo is crazy.

Feel however you want about Lecrae and Reach's approach, but Tireo is the guy that we've posted videos of a year or two ago that is on some sort of Ringo/G. Craig/recently-released-from-the-loony-bin steez. He has an album where he raps as Jesus.

Let me repeat that: he has an album where he raps AS JESUS.

Search for one of his videos on YouTube and you'll see the craziness for yourself. All that to say: no, this is not worth checking out.
He also said Da truth and Thisl sold their souls as well as being fake. Thisl actually commented on one of his videos I think.

Cowboy
01-17-2014, 06:19 PM
He also said Da truth and Thisl sold their souls as well as being fake. Thisl actually commented on one of his videos I think.

Yeah, he essentially went after everyone else, and then promotes his album. As Jesus. There was a request made by a lot of people on this board when he first popped up to not post his videos and/or watch them so he doesn't get more exposure. That's why I'm not posting any.

The Light Within
01-17-2014, 07:58 PM
Let's just go ahead and get this out of the way: Tireo is crazy.

Feel however you want about Lecrae and Reach's approach, but Tireo is the guy that we've posted videos of a year or two ago that is on some sort of Ringo/G. Craig/recently-released-from-the-loony-bin steez. He has an album where he raps as Jesus.

Let me repeat that: he has an album where he raps AS JESUS.

Search for one of his videos on YouTube and you'll see the craziness for yourself. All that to say: no, this is not worth checking out.

My discernment could be wrong, but there's not something quite right with him. And I'm basing that by simply watching or hearing him talk. His message sure isn't holy spirit filled...

Zema
01-17-2014, 10:24 PM
I've got to co sign with a few things seal is saying on this mayter. There are many people I know who aren't saved that won't listen to one single song where the artist is going hard for Christ, but they will listen to Church Clothes 2. They tell me they can ride with it because it makes them feel like Lecrae accepts them as they are and they don't feel convicted to change. They will not for the life of them listen to anything where the artist is going hard for Christ. If the unsaved see us as compromising the true gospel, what's next? The great deception won't necessarily come to us in the form of horns...Satan capitalizes on our love of the light in order to deceive. He wants us to think that he is good, truthful, loving, and powerful, essentially all the things that God is. To portray himself as a dark, devilish being with horns would not be very appealing to the majority of people. Most people are not drawn to darkness, but to light. Therefore, Satan appears as a creature of light to draw us to himself and his lies (false teaching).

Where in Scripture does it command a Christian to evangelize in their art?

Zema
01-17-2014, 10:42 PM
I wrote this on May 1, 2012 and still believe it holds true.

I believe the genre of Christian hip-hop has an inferiority complex. Let me explain. Due to previous negative connotations from the world who tend to think CHH is corny or wack we tend to go along with that view of the genre. Many people have only been exposed to have a few Christian hip-hop songs or projects and it may very well be true that the projects or songs they heard were indeed wack or corny.

However, due to not being accepted by the mainstream throughout the years we agree with them that CHH is wack..”except for me and my crew” mentality. Yes there are lots of wack rappers who are Christian just like there are lots of wack rappers who are not Christian. If you talk to most CHH rappers or whatever title they wanna be called you’ll find they think CHH is wack. I know this from being friends with them or by talking to them at events. So what new stuff have you been bumping? They will normally name a few people in their crew and say that is it and then express their disappointment with CHH. Yet how many have really dug deep and listened to a lot of the most skilled CHH albums/mixtapes? If someone has done that and still is disappointed and thinks CHH is wack then I can respect that. It is true that there is lots of room for improvement amongst CHH artists and it is true that some are wack. But this is the same with secular as well.

In sports, we have Christians who have been successful in their sports like Ray Lewis in football, Lin in basketball, Watson in golf, Pujols in baseball, Allyson Felix in track. And that’s just a small list. There are mad other successful skilled professional athletes who are Christians. They have more skill and have been more successful than their secular counterparts. Yet, we have an inferiority complex of Christians who rap and doubt that any can be as skilled as our secular counterparts. Why?

As my bol Ackdavis tweeted last week I’m convinced there are a rack of Christian mcs who are way better than their secular counterparts. This conclusion is made after listening to both genres. Yes, secular cats have bigger budgets and better promotion; better videos, better tours, graphics, etc--but I'm just talking about skills on the mic. I think in the next few years what I just tweeted will make more sense due to Christians gaining more exposure by mainstream secular media. But I don’t think we need to wait for the acceptance of the mainstream to start believing it now that there are Christians who are sick rappers! I’m not saying all this to say our main goal should be to prove that Christians are better than non-Christians. I am writing this because I know the mind state of many involved in hip-hop who are Christians needs to change. I believe this inferiority complex is one of the main reasons why Christian artists have a tendency to bite more well-known secular artists. They are looking up to them as the standard of what excellence is instead of making the best art possible. Let’s stop sleeping on how gifted some of our fellow Christian rappers are and stop thinking we have to be ashamed to be called Christian rappers.

5 years ago I started working for Temple University. For anyone out there who follows college football you know very well that they were the laughing stock of college football for many years. They hadn't had a winning season since 1990 and the previous year (2006) they were 1-11. I remember my boss- the head strength coach echoing the message of the coaching staff that I was about to be apart of something special. He told me I was about to be apart of one of the biggest turnarounds in college football history. I was skeptical at the time but he was right. In 2007 the Owls snapped their 20 game losing streak and ended 4-8. The next year they lost some close games and could have had a winning record but finished 5-7. The losing mentality was starting to change into a winning mentality. They started to believe that they WERE NOT LOSERS but they were WINNERS. I left for a job at Pitt in early 2009 but that year they went 9-4 and went to their first bowl game in over 30 years. This past year they won a bowl game and sent 10 players to the NFL (3 drafted; 7 free agent signings) I remember wearing my Temple hoody to get food one day back in 2008 and someone asking me "Are you serious? Do you really represent those bums?". The name had a negative connotation. However, Temple did not change their name to become successful and change that connotation. Changing the name is the easy way out. They worked hard and believed they could succeed.

If we continually listen to what everyone around us tell us "CHH is corny and wack" we will continue to believe what everyone tells us. Instead, I recommend us believing that God has given us gifts and talents to do our art in excellence for His glory. A change in name is not needed for us to be accepted by others, nor should acceptance be our goal. Galatians 1:10, "Are we seeking to please man or Christ? If I were seeking to please man, I would not be a bond servant of Christ."

Who said anything about shedding an inaccurate label to “become successful, change a connotation, [or] acceptance”?

Zema
01-17-2014, 10:50 PM
And for the record, Kanye is no “legend”. He's not even a good artist anymore.



P.S. Rap made by Christians hasn't been wack or corny overall for probably 20 years.

K-Train
01-18-2014, 12:43 AM
I
5 years ago I started working for Temple University. For anyone out there who follows college football you know very well that they were the laughing stock of college football for many years. They hadn't had a winning season since 1990 and the previous year (2006) they were 1-11. I remember my boss- the head strength coach echoing the message of the coaching staff that I was about to be apart of something special. He told me I was about to be apart of one of the biggest turnarounds in college football history. I was skeptical at the time but he was right. In 2007 the Owls snapped their 20 game losing streak and ended 4-8. The next year they lost some close games and could have had a winning record but finished 5-7. The losing mentality was starting to change into a winning mentality. They started to believe that they WERE NOT LOSERS but they were WINNERS. I left for a job at Pitt in early 2009 but that year they went 9-4 and went to their first bowl game in over 30 years. This past year they won a bowl game and sent 10 players to the NFL (3 drafted; 7 free agent signings) I remember wearing my Temple hoody to get food one day back in 2008 and someone asking me "Are you serious? Do you really represent those bums?". The name had a negative connotation. However, Temple did not change their name to become successful and change that connotation. Changing the name is the easy way out. They worked hard and believed they could succeed.


Your boss was Al Golden right?

He's been a good coach for us. But our D has SERIOUSLY got to get better.

K-Train
01-18-2014, 12:46 AM
Just came across this article. Not that it holds much weight, but it's worth checking out nonetheless.



http://www.barbadostoday.bb/2013/05/10/worldwide-message/

Light, your my boy and all.

But this post is not credible or cool what so ever.

The Light Within
01-18-2014, 01:04 AM
Light, your my boy and all.

But this post is not credible or cool what so ever.

Hey, I didn't write it poncho. I don't even know how I came across it, but wanted to share it. His views are definitely not my views.

The Light Within
01-18-2014, 01:05 AM
Where in Scripture does it command a Christian to evangelize in their art?

Is that all this music is. Just art?

Apex
01-18-2014, 02:02 AM
Is that all this music is. Just art?
Last I checked music fell under the art category.

Zema
01-18-2014, 10:51 AM
Is that all this music is. Just art?

So, you're not going to answer my question?

The Light Within
01-18-2014, 01:37 PM
So, you're not going to answer my question?

Alright. As Christians we are to encourage one another with music: “Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs” (Ephesians 5:19). So, while the primary purpose of music does seem to be worship, the Bible definitely allows for other uses of music. What I'm getting at is that Christians should use their musical abilities to glorify God and bring others to Christ. Entertainment is everywhere and we are constantly bombarded with it every turn, so as Christians while our music may entertain it should be used to minister. Personally, I'm not looking to be entertained. Obviously, the best kind of music is that which praises and glorifies God, so give me music that is God glorifying, Christ exalting, spiritually uplifting and beneficial to my soul.

Apex
01-18-2014, 03:22 PM
Alright. As Christians we are to encourage one another with music: “Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs” (Ephesians 5:19). So, while the primary purpose of music does seem to be worship, the Bible definitely allows for other uses of music. What I'm getting at is that Christians should use their musical abilities to glorify God and bring others to Christ. Entertainment is everywhere and we are constantly bombarded with it every turn, so as Christians while our music may entertain it should be used to minister. Personally, I'm not looking to be entertained. Obviously, the best kind of music is that which praises and glorifies God, so give me music that is God glorifying, Christ exalting, spiritually uplifting and beneficial to my soul.

And that's where you're wrong. No where in the bible does it say music should be a tool to evangelize, that's just something you decided to add. And it's not the first time Christians have made up their own rules on what those creating art can and cannot express with their work. The scripture you gave, which by the way has nothing to do with encouraging one another with our art(music), does not give an overview of how music should be expressed. In context it simply talks about as children of God we should sing to God and to one another collectively, always giving thanks to God.

JustinR
01-18-2014, 06:03 PM
I'm just going to leave this topic alone because it's so close to home for me, I'll take it personal. I'll let time tell, but I will admit, some of these responses, claims, accusations seem very off and judgmental. As someone who lives daily life with andy, a lot of what you guys say about him are misrepresentations. Some even go as far as to attack my pastor and church community. This seems very unfitting for some of you who don't know anything about us and claim to be in the Faith and practice love. That's all I'm saying on this topic again.

The Light Within
01-18-2014, 08:23 PM
And that's where you're wrong. No where in the bible does it say music should be a tool to evangelize, that's just something you decided to add.

Look closely.


So, while the primary purpose of music does seem to be worship, the Bible definitely allows for other uses of music.

Apex
01-18-2014, 08:37 PM
Look closely.
Read your post again.


What I'm getting at is that Christians should use their musical abilities to glorify God and bring others to Christ. Entertainment is everywhere and we are constantly bombarded with it every turn, so as Christians while our music may entertain it should be used to minister.
^^ Nice point, but isn't biblical. Just like a lot of beliefs people have in CHH about what music should and shouldn't be.

Zema
01-18-2014, 09:35 PM
Alright. As Christians we are to encourage one another with music: “Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs” (Ephesians 5:19). So, while the primary purpose of music does seem to be worship, the Bible definitely allows for other uses of music. What I'm getting at is that Christians should use their musical abilities to glorify God and bring others to Christ. Entertainment is everywhere and we are constantly bombarded with it every turn, so as Christians while our music may entertain it should be used to minister. Personally, I'm not looking to be entertained. Obviously, the best kind of music is that which praises and glorifies God, so give me music that is God glorifying, Christ exalting, spiritually uplifting and beneficial to my soul.


Now that you've admitted in a round-about way that there is no command in Scripture for a Christian to evangelize in their art, are you prepared to admit that you slandered those who don't evangelize in their art when you accused them of compromising?

The Light Within
01-18-2014, 10:04 PM
No. When these Christian rappers say they are making music to glorify God and then do music that contradicts what they previously said that is compromising. Is it not? What is the point in stating that one is a Christian Rapper and then not put Christ in their lyrics? Wait, is that why some want to shed the label? Anyhow, personally I don't find Andy's music isn't very edifying and much like music I used to buy before I listened to Christian rap. I've spent countless amounts of dollars towards these artists in general because I agree with what they are using their talents for. If it's going to aid in people coming to Christ I'm all for it. However, if their music increasingly becomes like secular worldly music, I won't support it.

Zema
01-18-2014, 10:14 PM
No. When these Christian rappers say they are making music to glorify God and then do music that contradicts what they previously said that is compromising. Is it not? What is the point in stating that one is a Christian Rapper and then not put Christ in their lyrics? Wait, is that why some want to shed the label? Anyhow, personally I don't find Andy's music isn't very edifying and much like music I used to buy before I listened to Christian rap. I've spent countless amounts of dollars towards these artists in general because I agree with what they are using their talents for. If it's going to aid in people coming to Christ I'm all for it. However, if their music increasingly becomes like secular worldly music, I won't support it.

So, if it's not evangelizing, it's not glorifying to God?

Apex
01-18-2014, 11:06 PM
No. When these Christian rappers say they are making music to glorify God and then do music that contradicts what they previously said that is compromising. Is it not? What is the point in stating that one is a Christian Rapper and then not put Christ in their lyrics? Wait, is that why some want to shed the label? Anyhow, personally I don't find Andy's music isn't very edifying and much like music I used to buy before I listened to Christian rap. I've spent countless amounts of dollars towards these artists in general because I agree with what they are using their talents for. If it's going to aid in people coming to Christ I'm all for it. However, if their music increasingly becomes like secular worldly music, I won't support it.

You're under the impression that glorying God = mentioning Christ in your lyrics. That might be the biggest misconception with your view on music, and one of the biggest misconceptions in regard to CHH. If you're living for God then you're giving him glory, especially when people around you are effected by that. If namedropping Jesus in a song is giving God glory to you, but not doing that is "worldly" then your whole view on CHH is twisted. You also clearly don't listen to much of Andy's music as you've mentioned many times that his music isn't edifying. If possible could you give an example of any particular songs that aren't edifying?

The Light Within
05-29-2014, 05:43 PM
Reach Records are showing themselves to be real grade A COWARDS and this type of reckless has officially made me take the gloves off. I will be confronting these dudes pastors once again and KB lives here in Tampa so he's first on my list.

Kanye is not in the Faith. There is only one Faith. This dude Andy was acting like a straight up groupie to Kanye's talent and art instead of at least being clear about what True Faith is. Who cares if people grew up in Church..... SATAN IS AN ANGEL.... Again this Gospel Bankrupted methodology that Anthony Bradley has spread to REACH and other groups is spreading like Cancer.

Like I said on my Facebook page.... "Us Christians today in America are the most Scary and Sugar-Coated Christian than in any Age of the Church."

Grace and Peace,
seal

Were you able to get in contact with their pastors?

Deadmanwalking
05-30-2014, 12:51 PM
This was a fun thread to peruse. :)